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National Coldtron 315


rmorris1953

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First question is there anybody that have them out there or know if any exist anymore?

 

There were reasons they went to the wayside many years ago. The same thing happened with coffee and they almost disappeared until Starbucks revived the coffee industry, 

 

Pepsi and coke discontinued the 1 gallon bottles and forced the new machines to go to bag in the box. That was a good thing but it made the cost of conversion very expensive. That part was not needed. The cost of a new soda cup drop went through the roof.  It was easier to just get a Pepsi or Coke loaner at no cost and let them have most of the profit. Now they have you by the seat of your pants with can and bottle prices. 83 cents on a average for a bottle of pop that costs them 15 cents really. The big guy gets rebates for the more cases they buy and they are not paying 83 cents a bottle. Same way with everything else including snacks. 

 

The Man helps the Big vendors at every turn. Better vendor prices better snack, better soda prices, at every turn. Now it is the micro markets. I have seen my customers loose big accounts in the last few months and it makes me mad as hell. They are working harder to try to make a living at the scrapes that are left.

 

The small guy has got to figure a way to get back to making good profits or the big ones are going to eat up the small vendor, With prices being so high profit margins are tight.

 

My business model last year was to make as much money as I could. I did very good for the first year of being in business. I worked my but off.

My business model for this year was to Gross less money but increase the profits and so far it looks to be working. Work less and profit more.

 

Some things we can make good money at and some not so much. I have at times talk to store managers about their pricing. Its all about Point of sale. One store manager told me they sell baby food at a lost. Really at a lost. Yes because they know we are all impulse buyers. They know when you go to the store you are going to buy more stuff. They know if they can get you in there you are not going to leave with just baby food. The man manipulates us at every turn. They move things around so you have to look for it. POS point of sale. We are all suckers.I was shocked to find out when I worked at the casino the carpet was designed to herd you where they wanted you  to go.

 

Sorry for the rambling but the small guy you and me needs to band together and figure this out or all of us will none existent in the future.

 

So here is my thought. What if you can make that $100 a week that nets 38% net 60%? Just throwing out numbers. Wouldn't 60% or even 50% be a lot better? It use to be you didn't set accounts if you didn't get the soda too. Why was that? Because snack alone was not enough. Soda was the profit maker but Pepsi and Coke and the rest have locked it up so now many accounts are just snacks and with healthy snacks there isn't much profit. We can't get the rebates because volume isn't enough.

 

I have extensive knowledge of Bag in the box systems. Every part from the setup to the finished product.  There is nothing better than a iced cup of soda. Brixed properly with the right mix of syrup water and ice. 

Coffee and soda are where the money is.....

 

So back to the beginning I want to experiment with a National Coldtron if anyone has one or knows where there is one.

Let me know.

 

I really hope this has sparked some interest or conversation. Pros,cons, negative and positive.  I am tired of the man wining.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I believe a soda costs about 15 cents to dispense, and another 10-15 for the cup and lid. With that said, my only gripe is that you are supposed to sanitize the machine to make sure the syrup doesn't harden up, nothing dirty or moldy is going up, and the taste is good.

The margin would be good, but I think the market prefers premanufactured goods in sealed containers now. At convenience stores, you see people buying lots of soda but not so much out of the fountain machine.

I think your idea is worth checking into but I don't think there will be any kind of a resurrection of that type of vending. Health laws alone could cause problems.

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Health issues can be addressed. With bag in the box they system is sealed all the way to delivery. Coffee vendors have a sanitize cycle that can be set to sanitize at different times.

I don't remember if that was a feature on cup drop. If it wasn't it could be done....  I don't think the cup price is that much. My figures are 17 cents on a finished product.

You have to remember a 16 oz drink will have 10 oz of product and 6 oz's of ice. Give or take an oz or so. You have so many choices with BIB. Juices, Energy Drinks , Non carbonated drinks etc. Your only limitation is the number of flavors. But even that could be addressed. With some software changes.

 

Convenience stores spend thousands of dollars to provide soda for a reason. Health safety is an issue even with them. You will notice that most use a push button because of refills. That is because they don't want people putting their cups against the lever to dispense the soda. Restaurants also bring a new glass and not refill the one you have.

 

The last Cup Drop vendors were very clean and any older ones could be made that way easily...

 

The net profit of a cup drop could be as high as 80% that would leave better pricing for other items in snack vendor.

 

So you say where do I get 80%. Lets say your cost is 20 cents a cup and you sell the 16 oz drink for a $1.

 

That comes to $4.80 a case at 20 cents a cup. A case of soda is what now $7 to $8 a case unless you can find it on sale?

 

And now look at the time involved. A sleeve of cups is about fifty cups and  there are approx   8 sleeves in the machine. That is 400 cups. With approx 640 oz's of syrup in a bag that is about 320 servings per bag times 8 bags. or 2,560 total. Or 106 cases. There will be times all you have to do is clean some, add a few cups and collect money.

 

A bag of Pepsi, Coke or Dr Pepper syrup is around $85 and can be bought from most Vistar, or there wholesalers. If you know someone who has a restaurant you could even have them buy it for you. Since all bottlers have minimum orders you would help them with their minimum order.. If you go online some generic brands like orange, strawberry and others are as low as $35.

 

I truly believe it can be done.

 

 .  

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I still have nightmares about cold cup machines. Granted, Bag in Box is way easier to keep clean, but damn. Those things were hard enough to keep clean and sanitary in the mild Pacific Northwest. I'm sure anyplace with cockroaches it would be...

 

 

...I think I just threw up in my mouth a little bit. I haven't regularly drank fountain soda since those days. Too many opportunities for nastyness.

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I still have nightmares about cold cup machines. Granted, Bag in Box is way easier to keep clean, but damn. Those things were hard enough to keep clean and sanitary in the mild Pacific Northwest. I'm sure anyplace with cockroaches it would be...

 

 

...I think I just threw up in my mouth a little bit. I haven't regularly drank fountain soda since those days. Too many opportunities for nastyness.

 

I won't buy soda from any cheap convenience store...  Yes you are right. The nozzles are where the bacteria grows. Dr Pepper is the worst of all. Having worked on fountains in restaurants and stores I know all about that. I have seen things that would make you vomit. And I won't name those places. But I can say those fancy restaurants.  $50 dollar steak houses, wash it down with beer or whiskey. Cup drops were never as bad as that...

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To make the economics of a 315 work for you I think need to move a lot of product.

 

I would like to see the numbers.

 

The fixed costs are very high.

I have not seen a price in the last 20 years I think it was over 5000.00 back then.

 

The labor costs to keep it clean is at least 100 times that of a stack machine.

 

Smarter locations will understand you are shifting costs from your pocket into there’s. In that you lower product costs results in 50 % more electricity used by the equipment.

 

How many vends of the slowest selling product, will you need each week to empty the bag before its sell by date?

 

 I recall the rack was not big enough hold 2 boxes and auto change valves for all flavor. Will you change bags early or wait for angry customers to call it in as a service call?

 

My wild guess is that you need a machine that is selling 30 cases from 6 flavors each week to reach the breakeven point. This would be a rare location. If open 8 to 5, 5 days a week this machine is making a sale every 3.5 minuets

  

Walta

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Convenience stores spend thousands of dollars to provide soda for a reason. 

  

 

Yes, they do, but I know many convenience stores that will not repair their fountain machines once they break.  They complain about how much the ice machine costs, or how troublesome the dispensers are, or how much the cups cost.  Sure, the LARGE c-store chains ALWAYS have their machines ready to go and I am sure they make a lot of money on them.  Circle K sells any-size fountain drinks for 69 cents + tax.  But that doesn't change the fact that people STILL buy bottled soda instead of the fountain drinks on a regular basis.  I'm not saying your idea is bad but I just don't think the market cares about fountain drinks as much as they ever used to.  People get grossed out when a bag of chips is 1 day past expiration.

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I worked for a vending company for 9 years back in the 1980s. They had  Rowe cup drinks and another cup drink I think they were Moyo Diebo. The Rowe's were nice machine the cup drop worked well ice maker gave very little trouble and it made the best orange soda I have ever tasted. Back in the 80s there lots of cotton mills and sewing plants in my home town and they put the post mix machines in ever plant. The biggest problem was roaches and ants there was no way to keep them out of the syrup everyday I would spend 15 minutes scooping them out of every machine I would service that day. They are a lot easier to service than can and bottle machines.

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I worked for a vending company for 9 years back in the 1980s. They had  Rowe cup drinks and another cup drink I think they were Moyo Diebo. The Rowe's were nice machine the cup drop worked well ice maker gave very little trouble and it made the best orange soda I have ever tasted. Back in the 80s there lots of cotton mills and sewing plants in my home town and they put the post mix machines in ever plant. The biggest problem was roaches and ants there was no way to keep them out of the syrup everyday I would spend 15 minutes scooping them out of every machine I would service that day. They are a lot easier to service than can and bottle machines.

Before BIB I could see that happening in a place like that. But I have seen roaches and nats in some of the best restaurants. And in most cases it comes down to cleanliness.

 

Even coffee vendors have problems with bugs. I have found when servicing a coffee vendor or any other vendor that has a waste bucket after dumping the waste bucket put about 2 oz's of Ivory dish soap in the waste bucket it kills the smell and the nats go away. I used to do this also on fountain drains. I would fill  a bucket with warm water and put dish soap in and pour down drain and let it set for a bit. Nats go away. 

 

Only worked on a few Rowes. Friend of my bought (Was a friend now competiton worth about 40 million or more. After 16 years in vending.) 25 of them from ARA years ago for just for the validators and coin mech. I helped him move all of them for the scrape. They had one big refrigeration unit in them. 3/4 hp. Service valve was 1/2 flared valve on the compressor. I cut that tubing about 2" from the valve and took a Vendo or Dixie evaporator and brazed it in. It fit perfectly in a D/N. Those were the heaviest decks ever. But they would frost up almost immediately. Sold all of them for $100 each. Was a good price back in the day. Never had one go down.    

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This was the procedure when I serviced the post mix machine. Open the machine check how many cups you need check co2 tank see how much syrup you need go to truck get the stuff you need. You would first take one cup to dip dead roaches and ants out of the syrup, fill up cup holder, pour syrup, take cup with bugs in it, put it in the bottom of the syrup box put empty gallon bottles on cup close box. Empty waste pale clean cup station wipe around where you pour syrup inside machine and outside, write vend numbers pull money and buy one drink out of machine to make sure it works correctly. It has been 25 years since I worked at that vending company and still can remember doing all this in less than 10 minutes.

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We didn't have *too* many bugs here in wet, wet Washington. Instead, you'd have to pour the syrup through a one inch think layer of mold. Or fish the mold out ( it usually came out in one big clump ) with a stick first if you weren't squeamish.The diet sodas never molded. To this day, drink the diet stuff.

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We didn't have *too* many bugs here in wet, wet Washington. Instead, you'd have to pour the syrup through a one inch think layer of mold. Or fish the mold out ( it usually came out in one big clump ) with a stick first if you weren't squeamish.The diet sodas never molded. To this day, drink the diet stuff.

If the mold refuses to have anything to do with the diet, I will too.

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