kai1836 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 I have been reading through a lot of information not only here but a lot of online articles and other websites. I am wondering, what is the biggest issue with being able to make a very large income with just bulk vending? I'm thinking you reach a certain size and can't grow anymore due to the demands of servicing your existing accounts? Any other ideas on what would stop a person from growing as large as they wanted to? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-man422 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 I would say a main factor is having all your machines close enough together. After you grow larger, it is hard to keep machines close so gas and time to service become major obstacles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nam Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Kai, I think we can all make a comfortable living but don't believe we will become wealthy in a monetary sense through bulk vending. There are only so many hours in the day to service a max. number of locations in that period. The only way to increase what your making is you'll need to pull more money out of each location. You could in some instances put in larger bulk vending machines but most locations won't support them. You could take your profit and use that money to invest in other areas for additonal income. WV allows quarter pushers as long as there is no booze or lottery tickets being sold. You could place some quarter pushers on your route and make alot more money than bulk candy machines. Maybe add some arcade machines such as cranes, etc. and they make alot more money than bulk machines. You simply can't do it with just bulk in my opinion. Comfortable Yes, wealthy No. nam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluePlate Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Servicing is the only thing from stopping the bulk vending business from being a true passive residual income flow. I always thought there will be a day when celluar technology will be so cheap we will be able to communicate with an indiviual bulk machine and know how much product is in there. If you could rest assure your vending machines have product in there, you maybe able to handle many many more machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post vendmaster1 Posted March 7, 2009 Popular Post Share Posted March 7, 2009 Bulk vending is a stepping stone for other ventures! Start up is relatively inexpensive and once you start growing machines and get a sizeable route you should have cashflow and time for other things while your machines are making money. EVERYTHING IS ABOUT LEVERAGE. You must leverage your time and money. Wealth does not have to be generated by one business. If you can generate 2 or 3 different incomes, none of them have to be substantial by themselves, but when you add them all up they equal that of a wealth generating income and you are diversified. Opportunities are created around as well as within us, we must locate them and act on them. That is where most people fall short. Some even recognize an opportunity but don't take the innitiative to capitolize on it. Wealth may not come solely from vending, however vending can be a large contributor! GOOD LUCK 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nam Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 vendmaster, Welcome to the forum and I'm enjoying reading your posts. Glad you have joined us and look forward to hearing more from you in the future. I think your suggestion in the post above to use your vending to allow pursuits in other areas was right on point. It's really nice to have machines out there pumping in quarters while your busy making money somewhere else. nam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jax Snacks Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Well for me the three biggest issues are turnover, saturation and rising costs. The turnover in this business can drive you crazy. I have talk to a few vendors about this and we always say, "If I could just keep all of the locations I ever had, life would be very good". Losing good locations is painful to say the least. At some point, every vendor will most likely hit the "brick wall" due to an eventual saturation in any market. When I started, it seemed soooo easy to get locations. Then all of the sudden, it became much more difficult for me and the locators to find more good spots. Everyone and his brother are dumping charity candy machines in every part of town. That's when vendors either branch off into other types of vending or expand geographically or change their model (from charity to commission as an example). The cost of product and new equipment is getting pretty ridiculous. I am really glad that I am not starting out today. These costs can really eat you alive if you don't manage them properly. Just my two cents. I don't envision getting super rich from vending and will never make the same amount of money I made as a software consultant. But, I have enough to get by on and don't have to sit in a cubicle all day and work for some overpaid idiot and most importantly can do what ever I want to do on any given day. The freedom is great and I will not trade it for anything, but the the cost of that freedom is very high - no job security, no insurance, no paid vacations, no sick days, no guarantees from month to month and no bailouts either. Happy vending. Jax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanderSnatch Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 wow dude, that was really good. seriously I just said what you said in another reply to some kid & I constantly tell my friends that when they question me & my bulk vending venture. that is the strategy I started my business with, having what you just said in the back of my mind. good stuff, it was a relief to hear you say that. it's like a check point for me, now i feel less crazy haha. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurtsman Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Bulk vending is not passive income, but it is close. Because it is not actually passive, it will only take you so far. In exchange for not being passive, the RoI is massively higher. My goal for RoI is 140-200%. I see vending as a way to significantly increase my income, and when my route is as large as I want to invest the time to handle, then I will invest is things that are more passive. I plan to move into investing in real estate. I will buy up small apartment buildings and manage them, while training someone I trust to replace me as the manager while still sending most of the money to me. However at this point the costs to buy property are vastly out of my reach. However I can buy a few machines. If you get the Nam deals off craigslist, you can get much better machines for the same price. In order to make vending more passive, you want to plan how frequently you will need to visit each stop. One of the advantages of smaller vend sizes is you can wait longer before servicing. I have a PMM location that will require servicing every 6 weeks unless I change another head there to PMM. It simply sells out shortly after that, and the office manager doesn't like to see it under 10%. (He is the primary customer and doesn't want to risk not having his PMM snack) However as I build racks I've got northwesterns with extra cab space. I stuffed 250 2 inch capsules in there. Sticker machines can hold a ton. Super 60s have some decent space also, so it is very reasonable to be able to push these machines onto a two month cycle without running out of product. With experience, I believe it will become much closer to passive income. Since my plan is to do bulk vending around a full time job, having it be relatively passive is fairly important. The other question here is the definition of wealthy. To me, wealthy is being able to pay the rest of your bills to live at the level of comfort you are used to without having to do another day of work in your life. I don't expect to be there for quite a few years, but when I do, I'll get there through cash flow. My non business expenses are well under 2000$ per month. I could maintain that while moving into a nice condo. That means I'd only need 2000$ per month cash flow to support my wife and I, and then I'd consider us wealthy. I think we would still work, because we choose to, but I'd also want to be able to spend more time on charitable projects. I don't see 2000$/month from vending as being particularly hard, though there would still be some work involved. Right now vending is accelerating my cash flow; I can spend the time, and I do enjoy servicing my route. If your goals are to have tens of millions, then you should plan for what comes after bulk vending. Vending however is a great stepping stone on that path, and can support a very comfortable life style by itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markvend Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 For me, I knew bulk vending in and of itself would not produce the kind of income I need for my financial plans. The income would be a stepping stone to multiply vending money. My mindset has always been to use extra cash flow from the business to: 1) Reinvest in the business and increase the number machines 2) Pay off debt to continue to increase cash flow year by year 3) Invest in Real Estate as lurtsman mentioned because of the passive income and property manager you can use to manage property for you. The ROI is not near what vending is, but it is a way you can multiply your money as you diversify away from vending. We have one rental house and have flipped some houses and owned a trailer park. I sold everything but the one house to concentrate on the vending which proved to be a good move. 4) The last area I have an interest in is stocks. Boy, I'm glad I'm not there yet. I sold before everything tanked to buy more machines. My goal is to buy high quality high dividend producing stocks and write covered calls on a portion of my portfolio. The main thing I continually train myself to think is "mulitply your money." Let one passive stream buy another to continually increase your monthly income. The frustration for me has been to want to diversify too quickly and not concentrate on getting the cash flow from vending to a really comfortable level. Your goal may simply be to produce ____number of dollars per month so you can quit your job. That's OK too. It brings the freedom into your life of working yourself. My route stretches 450 miles at the furthest points with just shy of 3,000 machines. We're in the final month of buying the company we started buying 5 years ago which will actually give us over 3,000 heads including a number of racks. I mention this not to brag or anything, but to let you know that you can run a large route with time and preparation. Currently I have 7 others on my team (part time) besides myself. That doesn't count my kids who do prep work and cleaning of machines occaisonally. Because of investing in the leadership aspect of the company, I am able to cover a larger area. I have maximized my route to give good customer service but not servicing too often to keep the near-passive aspect strong as was mentioned above. One thing that need to be said is that areas are different. I don't think you can necesarily take my model and implement it 100% in another area. Jax mentioned his area getting overrun with charity machines. This is an issue that affects you ROI and the number of machines you'll need to accomplish your goals. Another thing you experience is increased costs the further you go away from home and the bigger you grow. This area will surprise you because adding more machines does not bring a TRUE one to one increase in your income. You have extra gas and vehicle expenses that suddenly seem to matter a whole lot more than it did when you were smaller. I'm encountering the problem Jax mentioned with businesses closing and having to pull a lot of machines. But, I found a jewel in my wife I didn't know I had who placed about 40 machines last month. I also had an old friend approach me who worked for another vending placing machines who I am going to incorporate this year. My point is that problems will always come when you set out to run a real business, but there are answers to overcome those problems if you don't give up in fear or frustration. Not everyone will agree with what I've said, and that's OK. Like I said, your area will be slightly different. I hope some of the stuff I shared will spark you in growing your company. If you do intend to get big, please seek professional help. My accountant and lawyer have been invaluable to help me protect our company. Thanks, Mark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Theres some great posts here, its very interesting reading everyones different views on the subject, thanks a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROGERS VENDING Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Shouldn't 100k (profit) a year be a realistic long term goal? I wouldn't see why someone like Mark, with 2000 or 3000 machines, couldn't clear $200,000 to $300,00 per year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Faith Vending Posted March 8, 2009 Popular Post Share Posted March 8, 2009 I think its like buying a fixer house; its only time and money. Obviously all these other reasons exist. It is a challenge to survive in this very competitive business. The only way to make a very good living is having more and better locations. It is a numbers game. The one thing to remember is you will never be fired by an incompetent fool who has brown nosed his way up and could never do your job, no more ridiculous goals and pay plans that are unattainable, no more working yourself to the bone for someone else, and no more being DOWNSIZED!! Power to the entreprenuers who are willing to take the risks and have OUR skin in the game and fight the socialists who are trying to keep us from succeeding. Sorry, I got carried away. I'm going to take a heart pill now. Keep up the good fight. Jim 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honda man Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Right on Jim! Power to the people! I like your comments regarding bosses and unattainable goals. My sentiments exactly. Ernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T BIRD Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Holy Macrel! Great information on this thread. Thanks everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurtsman Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 If I get that big, I have a close friend that I will have help me collect, and I might send my wife out occasionally to help. My wife is on my bank accounts, and I'd trust my friend with that information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nam Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Growing larger than we are personally able to service and collect is a definite barrier not easy to overcome. It had better be your wife or really close friend if you don't want you cash flow disappearing. nam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jax Snacks Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 So nam, what you are concluding is that a wife does NOT make your cash flow disappear! ROTFL Jax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nam Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 Jax, I could come up with a bunch of lines to follow up on your lead but that would be less than honest. Mine wife is actually my best asset and can't hardly get her to go shopping at the mall. She goes on alot of sales calls with me, helps me do intalls and keeps track of the money. She's also my navigator. I'd literally be lost without her. She knows how to do the GPS. Actually, when I'm working on a car she jumps right in there with me. She takes the out feed side of my table saw and stands there with flying sawdust and melting plastic. I wouldn't trade her for a thousand of those Beaver Islands. nam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antoniocinisi Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 So nam, what you are concluding is that a wife does NOT make your cash flow disappear! ROTFL Jax I hear ya !! on the other hand at least it stays in the family! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nam Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 Thanks Kelly, I'm very lucky to have her and the most amazing thing is she puts up with me. nam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siteacq1 Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 Some really good, useful and motivating discussions here - thanks everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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