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Snackshop 123c advice


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I purchased my first snack machines today...2 AP Snackshop 123c 5-wides.  I got the machines for 200 a piece...but I want to make sure they are in reliable condition before placing them.  Besides the bill validators and coin acceptors, what should I check on these machines before putting them in service?  Is there anything in particular that goes bad with these machines?  I know the golden eye sensors have been disconnected on both machines.  Is this something I should reconnect and get working?  Or is it not worth the hassle.  Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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They were pretty good machines.  They should have metal delivery bins as they were the last models built before AP began making their crappy plastic bins.  If they are metal then the GE should be workable on them.  They may have disconnected them due to sensor issues or the issue of gum/mint not being detected correctly.  The only other issue I'm aware of is that the motor harness was routed to the top of the cabinet through a glued-on wire clip.  This clip usually comes loose and then the harness hangs down off the logic board and behind the power supply.  The full weight of the harness can cause, if left this way for many months, one or more wires to break off of the logic board connector.  This disables motors used by that wire.  The only fix, since AP stopped producing the cabinet back harness, is to bypass the broken wire with a new wire from board to top cabinet connector, or thereabouts.  

So check that harness and then do a motor test and see of all selections are working.  I have parts for them if any are needed.

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10 hours ago, AZVendor said:

They were pretty good machines.  They should have metal delivery bins as they were the last models built before AP began making their crappy plastic bins.  If they are metal then the GE should be workable on them.  They may have disconnected them due to sensor issues or the issue of gum/mint not being detected correctly.  The only other issue I'm aware of is that the motor harness was routed to the top of the cabinet through a glued-on wire clip.  This clip usually comes loose and then the harness hangs down off the logic board and behind the power supply.  The full weight of the harness can cause, if left this way for many months, one or more wires to break off of the logic board connector.  This disables motors used by that wire.  The only fix, since AP stopped producing the cabinet back harness, is to bypass the broken wire with a new wire from board to top cabinet connector, or thereabouts.  

So check that harness and then do a motor test and see of all selections are working.  I have parts for them if any are needed.

Thank you for your advice...I will do as you said.  Does AP sell updated sensors for the GE that would detect products better than the original sensors in this machine?  Would it be worthwhile to replace the sensors?  

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No they don't.  There were only factory GE kits for these which you may have trouble getting now.   You have to remember that AP was bought out by the bastards at Crane several years ago and they don't really support the old AP models.  The best bet, especially with the price you paid for them, is to go to an aftermarket board and use the guaranteed vend system that comes with it.

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Don't waste your time or money on the GE system. You would be wise to replace the battery on the computer board as these machines are now 15+years old. In, fact, I have begun to upgrade my 120 machines with the new In-One kit so I can keep spare boards and displays on hand for equipment in the field. A bad credit display will set you back $200+.

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The batteries are easy to change and you can get them here: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00R1VJ1BA/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

That is the kit I recommend, but can't say if the drop sensors will be worth the money. I beta tested the kit with drop sensors, and never got them to work. I recently ordered more kits from In-One and the drop sensors are not available for this at this time. I was told that the factory GE sensors will work on the In-One board. I will be testing that theory this weekend.

I have 3 of these systems deployed in a high volume hospital, and they have worked flawlessly, tho without drop sensors. I am using credit cards and DEX telemetry interfaced with Lightspeed. I will be building up 4 more machines this coming week for the same account (in my new platinum color scheme).  

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4 hours ago, lacanteen said:

The batteries are easy to change and you can get them here: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00R1VJ1BA/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

That is the kit I recommend, but can't say if the drop sensors will be worth the money. I beta tested the kit with drop sensors, and never got them to work. I recently ordered more kits from In-One and the drop sensors are not available for this at this time. I was told that the factory GE sensors will work on the In-One board. I will be testing that theory this weekend.

I have 3 of these systems deployed in a high volume hospital, and they have worked flawlessly, tho without drop sensors. I am using credit cards and DEX telemetry interfaced with Lightspeed. I will be building up 4 more machines this coming week for the same account (in my new platinum color scheme).  

Thanks again.  So even without the drop sensors, your account doesn't complain of lost money due to incomplete vends?  

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3 hours ago, lacanteen said:

All are dual spiral and properly matched size-to-product. Even a cave man could fill them. woot_zps0unb4ham.gif

Can you explain to me more about dual spiral?  Does that mean that two spirals are assigned to one product?  So that cuts down on the number of products in the machine, but makes the machine more reliable?  How hard would it be to convert my machine to dual spiral?  Does it just need to be reprogrammed, or do I need to get different motors?  Sorry for all the questions, but this is my first snack machine.  Could you post a picture of one of your stocked 123 machines?  Thanks George!

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It was a $5 per selection option when the machine was new. Not cheap to convert from single. It consists of a dual output motor, a left & right spiral, an additional spiral hub (LH gray), and the price tab holder in front. About $30.00 per selection. If matched with the right spiral, it's almost impossible to mis-vend. 

 

IMG_20170514_154205.jpg

IMG_20170514_154216.jpg

IMG_20170513_155636.jpg

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5 hours ago, lacanteen said:

It was a $5 per selection option when the machine was new. Not cheap to convert from single. It consists of a dual output motor, a left & right spiral, an additional spiral hub (LH gray), and the price tab holder in front. About $30.00 per selection. If matched with the right spiral, it's almost impossible to mis-vend. 

 

IMG_20170514_154205.jpg

 

 

So all those parts fit on the existing trays?  Is D&S vending the best place to buy those parts?

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If your trays are original, parts can be had from VE or D&S. You will need 1 each of items 2, 12, 14, 15, and 20 per selection from the parts breakdown below.

123a.JPG

123b.JPG

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The only thing In-One adds to the party is an updated platform, and reasonably priced replacement boards and credit displays. I have about 100 of these and DEX/telemetry all of them. Recently, The boards get stupid and lose sales info. The prices stay, just the meter goes to zero when it's DEXed, or whenever it feels like it. Also, we go through 3 or 4 credit displays per year at $200 a pop, why not spend another Bennie and upgrade the board? If you're not, DEXing or doing card telemetry, these machines will do fine for you in their native state. 

I just finished testing the board with the factory GE sensors............and they work. Most of the time the GE sensors fail because the ribbon cable gets tangled in the door and hardware that holds the sensors on gets lost. I removed and discarded the gum tray and routed the harness under the bottom snack tray to protect it. I had to clear the initial sensor error, then set it to "drop" instead of "home".  Here's my special door colors for this particular account:

 

IMG_20170515_164203.jpg

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3 hours ago, lacanteen said:

The only thing In-One adds to the party is an updated platform, and reasonably priced replacement boards and credit displays. I have about 100 of these and DEX/telemetry all of them. Recently, The boards get stupid and lose sales info. The prices stay, just the meter goes to zero when it's DEXed, or whenever it feels like it. Also, we go through 3 or 4 credit displays per year at $200 a pop, why not spend another Bennie and upgrade the board? If you're not, DEXing or doing card telemetry, these machines will do fine for you in their native state. 

I just finished testing the board with the factory GE sensors............and they work. Most of the time the GE sensors fail because the ribbon cable gets tangled in the door and hardware that holds the sensors on gets lost. I removed and discarded the gum tray and routed the harness under the bottom snack tray to protect it. I had to clear the initial sensor error, then set it to "drop" instead of "home".  Here's my special door colors for this particular account:

 

IMG_20170515_164203.jpg

Nice door color.  What credit displays go bad George?  The factory displays or the In-One displays?

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3 hours ago, SCOTT1963 said:

I agree with upgrading but the factory displays are about $70 here and a drop sensor kit for the factory board is about $130-$140 

A search for 360244  points to the display for the Vendo M&M machine for $75. The last catalog showed a 360244R for A/P display at $169

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One of the 123s that I purchased is not recognizing a shelf.  When I try to test vend, it says that the entry is invalid.  I know the problem is not the tray itself because I've swapped them in the machine and tray works when it's put into a different location. The back connector looks fine to me...so I'm not sure what to check next.  Any suggestions for troubleshooting the problem?

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Follow the steps below

Diagnosing “invalid choice” on a 120 Series

  1. Press enter display shows “MIS”

  2. Press right arrow until display shows “DIAGNOSTICS”

  3. Press enter

  4. Right arrow until display shows “TEST MOTORS” (not “TEST VEND”)

  5. Press enter

  6. Type in the selection number showing the invalid choice message, press enter and watch the display. In a few seconds the display will say “PASS or FAIL”. If motor passes proceed to step 7. If motor fails you have a bad motor, wiring problem or failed control board.

  7. Press “ESC” until display shows “DIAGNOSTIC”

  8. Press right arrow until display shows “SECURITY”

  9. Press enter

  10. Press left arrow 1 time display shows MACHINE RESET N

  11. Change the N to a Y by pressing the plus (+) key

  12. Press enter

  13. Display shows “RESET MESSAGES”

  14. Press plus key until display says “RESET OPTIONS” (at this point notify the customer that if you proceed they will need to reprogram their machine when completed i.e. prices, motor pairs, temperature etc. the MIS information will not be lost.)

  15. Press enter

  16. Machine shows “ARE YOU SURE N.

  17. Change the N to a Y by pressing the plus (+) key.

  18. Machine should beep and the display will go back to “MACHINE RESET N. (not all beep so don’t worry if it doesn’t)

  19. Now ask customer if this is a stand alone snack or if a frozen/refrigerated 960/320 is attached.

    1. If a frozen/refrigerated is attached have the customer open and close the inner door (door with the 2 latches) of the frozen/refrigerated. And then close the door of the snack.

    2. If there isn’t a frozen/refrigerated attached close the door of the snack

  20. Wait for the “HAVE A NICE DAY” message to appear.

  21. Enter in the selection that previously showed “INVALID CHOICE” it should now show a price it may not be the correct price but it should show a price. If it does you have solved the customer’s problem and you can proceed to step 22 if not start over at step 1.

  22. Customer will now need to reset the prices. If there is a 320/960/460 attached they will also need to reset the Motor Pairs and Temperature

 

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1 hour ago, venddoctor said:

Follow the steps below

Diagnosing “invalid choice” on a 120 Series

  1. Press enter display shows “MIS”

  2. Press right arrow until display shows “DIAGNOSTICS”

  3. Press enter

  4. Right arrow until display shows “TEST MOTORS” (not “TEST VEND”)

  5. Press enter

  6. Type in the selection number showing the invalid choice message, press enter and watch the display. In a few seconds the display will say “PASS or FAIL”. If motor passes proceed to step 7. If motor fails you have a bad motor, wiring problem or failed control board.

  7. Press “ESC” until display shows “DIAGNOSTIC”

  8. Press right arrow until display shows “SECURITY”

  9. Press enter

  10. Press left arrow 1 time display shows MACHINE RESET N

  11. Change the N to a Y by pressing the plus (+) key

  12. Press enter

  13. Display shows “RESET MESSAGES”

  14. Press plus key until display says “RESET OPTIONS” (at this point notify the customer that if you proceed they will need to reprogram their machine when completed i.e. prices, motor pairs, temperature etc. the MIS information will not be lost.)

  15. Press enter

  16. Machine shows “ARE YOU SURE N.

  17. Change the N to a Y by pressing the plus (+) key.

  18. Machine should beep and the display will go back to “MACHINE RESET N. (not all beep so don’t worry if it doesn’t)

  19. Now ask customer if this is a stand alone snack or if a frozen/refrigerated 960/320 is attached.

    1. If a frozen/refrigerated is attached have the customer open and close the inner door (door with the 2 latches) of the frozen/refrigerated. And then close the door of the snack.

    2. If there isn’t a frozen/refrigerated attached close the door of the snack

  20. Wait for the “HAVE A NICE DAY” message to appear.

  21. Enter in the selection that previously showed “INVALID CHOICE” it should now show a price it may not be the correct price but it should show a price. If it does you have solved the customer’s problem and you can proceed to step 22 if not start over at step 1.

  22. Customer will now need to reset the prices. If there is a 320/960/460 attached they will also need to reset the Motor Pairs and Temperature

 

Thanks...I'll give this a try.  If the motor test fails, what is the best way to troubleshoot the wiring harness?  

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20 hours ago, lacanteen said:

A search for 360244  points to the display for the Vendo M&M machine for $75. The last catalog showed a 360244R for A/P display at $169

It works in the 123 you just need to not tighten the validator down so hard, worth the effort for a NLA part from AP.

 

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20 hours ago, venddoctor said:

Follow the steps below

Diagnosing “invalid choice” on a 120 Series

  1. Press enter display shows “MIS”

  2. Press right arrow until display shows “DIAGNOSTICS”

  3. Press enter

  4. Right arrow until display shows “TEST MOTORS” (not “TEST VEND”)

  5. Press enter

  6. Type in the selection number showing the invalid choice message, press enter and watch the display. In a few seconds the display will say “PASS or FAIL”. If motor passes proceed to step 7. If motor fails you have a bad motor, wiring problem or failed control board.

  7. Press “ESC” until display shows “DIAGNOSTIC”

  8. Press right arrow until display shows “SECURITY”

  9. Press enter

  10. Press left arrow 1 time display shows MACHINE RESET N

  11. Change the N to a Y by pressing the plus (+) key

  12. Press enter

  13. Display shows “RESET MESSAGES”

  14. Press plus key until display says “RESET OPTIONS” (at this point notify the customer that if you proceed they will need to reprogram their machine when completed i.e. prices, motor pairs, temperature etc. the MIS information will not be lost.)

  15. Press enter

  16. Machine shows “ARE YOU SURE N.

  17. Change the N to a Y by pressing the plus (+) key.

  18. Machine should beep and the display will go back to “MACHINE RESET N. (not all beep so don’t worry if it doesn’t)

  19. Now ask customer if this is a stand alone snack or if a frozen/refrigerated 960/320 is attached.

    1. If a frozen/refrigerated is attached have the customer open and close the inner door (door with the 2 latches) of the frozen/refrigerated. And then close the door of the snack.

    2. If there isn’t a frozen/refrigerated attached close the door of the snack

  20. Wait for the “HAVE A NICE DAY” message to appear.

  21. Enter in the selection that previously showed “INVALID CHOICE” it should now show a price it may not be the correct price but it should show a price. If it does you have solved the customer’s problem and you can proceed to step 22 if not start over at step 1.

  22. Customer will now need to reset the prices. If there is a 320/960/460 attached they will also need to reset the Motor Pairs and Temperature

 

This worked for my machine...now it sees the selections on that tray.  Thanks!

Another issue I've noticed is sometimes the display flickers and the machine kicks me out of the programming menus.  Is this the sign of a loose connection or board that is going bad? 

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