Rexlex Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 I've got an old drop bottle Bevmax that the customer is reporting is not accepting either coins or bills. I am heading over there in a few minutes to check the error codes. I purchased this machine in August, it ran fine until Feb when the control board had to be replaced. Guy said it had shorted out. Anyway, any advice on what to look for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cvending Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 The obvious is to make sure that the power is on. Are the lights& display working? Second.y I would check the coin mech. Coin return button might be actuating the lever that holds gate open on acceptor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 ok, went by and the lights were on and appear working. I put a dollar in and it accepted it. I hit coin return and it gave me change in dimes. Looked at the coin mech and it was out of quarters. Person who called in the problem had already left for the day. When I open the door it tells me the "check errors". I do and it gives me "Vend error A7 and D8". I test both of those and they vend. I close the door and then the display gives me "Remove product" and it won't take money. So, I power off and on and now display is back and the DBA and coin mech lights show fine. I put in quarters and hit coin return and it gives me quarters. I guess I'm assuming it works again as I didn't actually test a vend but decided to head home to see if I can figure out those vend errors. Any other insights would be appreciated. Is it possible that being out of quarter would be the problem? This is an MEI with nickles,dimes,quarters and dollar coins. Dollar coins were low as well, probably 8 left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZVendor Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 If the machine is using an MDB coin mech then you need to use the Tube Fill program to fill the coin mech with so the machine knows how many coins are in the changer. Don't fill the tubes themselves but in the Tube Fill mode, drop the coins into the top of the mech to be counted by the machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 If the machine is using an MDB coin mech then you need to use the Tube Fill program to fill the coin mech with so the machine knows how many coins are in the changer. Don't fill the tubes themselves but in the Tube Fill mode, drop the coins into the top of the mech to be counted by the machine. How do I know if it's an MDB? I did get quarters back when I did a coin return when I previously didn't, wouldn't that mean it isn't one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZVendor Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Check the model of coin mech or the type of coin mech harness. The MDB harness terminates in a small 6 pin plug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 ok, went by and the lights were on and appear working. I put a dollar in and it accepted it. I hit coin return and it gave me change in dimes. Looked at the coin mech and it was out of quarters. Person who called in the problem had already left for the day. When I open the door it tells me the "check errors". I do and it gives me "Vend error A7 and D8". I test both of those and they vend. I close the door and then the display gives me "Remove product" and it won't take money. So, I power off and on and now display is back and the DBA and coin mech lights show fine. I put in quarters and hit coin return and it gives me quarters. I guess I'm assuming it works again as I didn't actually test a vend but decided to head home to see if I can figure out those vend errors. Any other insights would be appreciated. Is it possible that being out of quarter would be the problem? This is an MEI with nickles,dimes,quarters and dollar coins. Dollar coins were low as well, probably 8 left. Sound like you have a couple of different error here... firstly do you know which model bev max you have? It is always good to use the tube fill/dispense feature to prevent your machine from disabling the bill validator from being disabled but I don't think this is what has caused the issue in your case as the customer also informed you that the machine would not accept coins either. You mentioned that when you closed the door of the machine it displayed "remove product" this can be caused by warm air entering the machine when the door is open which causes mist to build up on your sensor reflector. Another reason could be that your sensors are not aligned correctly which would also cause this error message to be displayed with a series of beeps. I would check with your customer to see if the machine was beeping when they were trying to insert money because this could be the reason for that problem. I presume that you cleared your vend errors after they were displayed? Did you perform a "self test" to check how many errors were being displayed after that... on your standard bev max 5591 you should have 9 errors displayed after doing running a self test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 Sound like you have a couple of different error here... firstly do you know which model bev max you have? It is always good to use the tube fill/dispense feature to prevent your machine from disabling the bill validator from being disabled but I don't think this is what has caused the issue in your case as the customer also informed you that the machine would not accept coins either. You mentioned that when you closed the door of the machine it displayed "remove product" this can be caused by warm air entering the machine when the door is open which causes mist to build up on your sensor reflector. Another reason could be that your sensors are not aligned correctly which would also cause this error message to be displayed with a series of beeps. I would check with your customer to see if the machine was beeping when they were trying to insert money because this could be the reason for that problem. I presume that you cleared your vend errors after they were displayed? Did you perform a "self test" to check how many errors were being displayed after that... on your standard bev max 5591 you should have 9 errors displayed after doing running a self test. I see on the service sticker my tech gave me when he installed the board it is a Model 55xx Yes, I cleared the errors. I did not perform a "self test". What does this do? I just got an email from the customer that it has happened again so I'm going over there around 6pm to check it out. She states it has been an intermittant problem. I'll find out if she has heard any beeping coming from the machine and if any new errors are showing up. My tech guy is having surgery tomorrow so I'm on my own for a few days. I appreciate any help. Check the model of coin mech or the type of coin mech harness. The MDB harness terminates in a small 6 pin plug. I'll gather this info tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZVendor Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 The 5500 series is an MDB capable board so you're probably running MDB components. The self test runs a short test of each solenoid without firing any of them. A properly operating machine will end the test with Errors=9. No, I have no idea why DN thought that Errors=9 should mean the machine is working properly but my only guess is that the 9 means that there is a capability of an extra 9 selection shelf which isn't there. This is the same as No Row H on AP snack machines after they run their diagnostics. If your machine is showing, or blinking intermittently, the Remove Bottle message then your drop sensor is out of adjustment and probably just on the edge of it. A slight adjustment (in the correct direction) should correct that. If the machine is just not taking money again then you need to consider that a flickering or burned out lamp nearby or in the ceiling could be causing it or that either the coin mech or validator could be causing it. You might need to try a validator first, and if the issue reoccurs then try a different coin mech. Also check that you have a ground pin on your cord. You could also have fluctuating power from the wall or low voltage from your transformer. If this machine shares a circuit with any other high current draw like another soda machine, coffee pot, microwave, water cooler, etc., then that could cause low voltage to this machine. There are tolerances that they don't work well when outside of or your transformer has a weak output on one of it's voltages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorris1953 Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 AZ there are Six connections on the board. There are only 5 being used there for 5X9 = 45. With 1 shelf missing or nine soldoids (Can't remember Cajun is that the way it is spelled?) not present. With that said what coin mech are you using in the 5591. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I just got an email from the customer that it has happened again so I'm going over there around 6pm to check it out. She states it has been an intermittant problem. What is happening again... is the machine not excepting coin & bills? What brand/model payment systems do you have in the machine? Is there a message scrolling across on the display? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 All I remember is an MEI coin. I'll get the specific on it and bill acceptor tonight. I have not heard back from my contact on whether the machine is beeping or scrolling a message when this happens. Yes, they are reporting it is intermittently not accepting either coins or bills. If it is MDB and I added money directly into the coin mech could it just think it doesn't have any change? I'm assuming it would be scolling "exact change" if so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 AZ there are Six connections on the board. There are only 5 being used there for 5X9 = 45. With 1 shelf missing or nine soldoids This is correct & a standard "baby bev" will report 24 errors... it is always good practice to check & clear any errors each time you visit a site that has a bev max. You should scroll thru all errors to see if there are any other issues that need to be fixed also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 Does anyone have a document of the error codes and their meanings? I have one but it is for the newer models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 If it is MDB and I added money directly into the coin mech could it just think it doesn't have any change? I'm assuming it would be scolling "exact change" if so. Yes... you should get the message "use correct change" I am not sure if this message can be disabled or bypassed or not but I doubt it... this leads me to think that the machine is not excepting money because of a different reason. I would think that if it was a coin mech or bill validator problem then this would show up as an error on the machine. I am leaning more towards a problem with your sensors which is causing the machine to go out of service as this is an issue that you have seen happen yourself when you were there the other day. Does anyone have a document of the error codes and their meanings? I have one but it is for the newer models. What do you mean by error codes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 TEST MODE Enter TEST MODE by opening the service door and pressing the blue Service button twice. The display will read” TEST MODE”. NEXT ITEM - Press key “A” LIST ERRORS - Press key “B” Allows the service technician to view a list of all recorded errors. Press the letter “B” on the keypad and the display will scroll “LIST ERRORS”, then change to “NO ERROR” if no errors exist or, if errors are present, one of the error prompts below will be displayed. If an error code is displayed, press the “*” key to view the next error until “END LIST” is displayed. With “END LIST” showing on the display, press the “CLR” key to clear errors. When the “CLR” key is pressed, an audible tone will be heard and the display will change momentarily to “OK” then back to TEST MODE. If you wish to exit the list without clearing errors, simply push the “*” key and the display will return to list errors. If the CLR key is pressed prior to reaching the end of the list, the display will jump to END LIST. Explanations for the error codes are listed below. Note: The prompts listed will only show on the display if an error has occurred. NO ERROR No errors have occurred. COIN ERR Indicates a fault message from the coin mechanism. BILL ERR Indicates a fault message from the bill validator. CARD ERR Indicates a fault message from the card reader. MDB ERR Indicates a communication error between the control board and peripherals. MEM ERR Indicates a problem with the program memory or associated components. This is a fatal error and will shutdown the machine. This error will usually occur if the battery on the controller is in need of replacement or if a “MASTER RESET” occurred due to changing the controller EPROM or by manually doing a MASTER RESET. After clearing this error, the vender will have to be reprogrammed, as all options will have been reset. VEND ERR Indicates one or more channels/solenoids are out of service. When the display reads “VEND ERR”, press the “A” key and the first channel/solenoid with a problem will be displayed. Continue pressing the “A” key to display additional vend errors (if any) until the display returns to “VEND ERR”. NOTE: IF THIS ERROR IS SHOWN, ALL PROBLEMS MUST BE REPAIRED AND A “SELF TEST” (see below) MUST BE PERFORMED IN ORDER TO RETURN THE LISTED CHANNEL/SOLENOID TO SERVICE. PWR OUT Indicates an interruption of the power to the controller board. When the display reads PWR OUT, press the “A” key and the date and time of the last power interruption will be displayed. Continue pressing the “A” key and the display will show the time and date of the last 5 power outages, starting with the most recent. LOW 28V Indicates a problem with the controller board’s 28 Volt power supply. This is a fatal error and will put the vender out of service until resolved. ROW a ERR The a represents the letter of the row drive that failed (A-F ie. ROWBERR) and gives the indication that the B row failed during the last test firing. This error will only occur while performing the “SELF TEST” (see explanation below) and the controller board has encountered a short or a very high current condition. COLnERR The n indicat es the number of a column driver (1-9, i.e. COL1ERR). This error is displayed if the controller has detected a short or a very high current condition during the last test firing. This is a fatal error and will put the vender out of service until resolved. OVER CUR Indicates an over current condition has occurred (i.e. a shorted component or a low power condition). This error is serious. If it reoccurs after CLEAR ERRORS, further troubleshooting will be required. TEMP SEN Indicates a temperature sensor failure while health control is enabled. HEALTH T Indicates the temperature in the vender did not reach 41 degrees F within 30 minutes after the door was closed. *HEALTH”C” Indicates the temperature in the vender went above 41 degrees F since the last door closure or remained above 41 degrees F for longer than 15 minutes. NO KEYPAD Indicates a failure of the keypad or associated cable (will show on display on power up and stay there until problem is resolved). BAD RAM Indicates a problem with the control board. END LIST Indicates you have scrolled through the list of all present errors. Press the “CLR” key and display will change to “OK”, an audible tone will be heard and the display will change to “NO ERRORS”. Press the “CLR” key to return to “TEST MODE”, or the “A” key to proceed to “SELF TEST”. “Select Another Item ” – The selection can not vend due to the error code indicated. The code can be one or more of the following: “N” – Controller has determined the solenoid is missing. “V” – Controller detected a solenoid fault on this selection. “H” – Selection has been blocked under Health Guard. “D” – Selection has been blocked by Enabled Item mode. Sold Out– Product was not detected after previous vend and controller has marked selection as sold out. Cool In ### Minutes – Selection has been placed under cool down control and will be available at the indicated time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 Thanks for the info above. "VEND ERR Indicates one or more channels/solenoids are out of service." This is the error I had when I checked it yesterday. When I scrolled through the errors, I got "vend error A7 and D8". I'm assuming the solenoid controls the flapper, it is possible that for those selections those are causing the problems? Should I remove product from those selections to see if the problem goes away? Then I would know to replace those solenoids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 There are many different reasons that could cause that error to show You are best to read the TROUBLESHOOTING “SELECTION WILL NOT VEND” ISSUES section on pages 37-38 of the manual https://www.azdes.gov/InternetFiles/RSAVendingManuals/pdf/dn_3561_baby_bevmax_operators_manual.pdf I don't think that this problem is related to your other issue because it would only disable the 2 selections you mentioned above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 There are many different reasons that could cause that error to show You are best to read the TROUBLESHOOTING “SELECTION WILL NOT VEND” ISSUES section on pages 37-38 of the manual https://www.azdes.gov/InternetFiles/RSAVendingManuals/pdf/dn_3561_baby_bevmax_operators_manual.pdf I don't think that this problem is related to your other issue because it would only disable the 2 selections you mentioned above Great, I'll run through that tonight and see if I can figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 4, 2015 Author Share Posted June 4, 2015 Did get a late email and when it doesn't accept money it is showing "REMOVE PRODUCT". They can apparently shake the machine and it will then work. Heading over there now to see if I can replicate the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew0582 Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 drop sensor thinks the product is still in the bin and wont vend another product. either turn off drop sensor, realign sensor or replace sensor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexlex Posted June 4, 2015 Author Share Posted June 4, 2015 OK, I'm afraid this one isn't going to be easy but considering this "paying my dues." When I get to the machine it is fine, Display showing "Insert money, make selection." I go into the List Error menu and all it gives me is "PWR OUT" which is from when I reset it earlier. I clear error. I run a Self Test, I get "Errs= 9" which I recall means solenoid test is fine. I check the Drop Sensor setting and it is enabled. This is an old machine and I'm not sure it has a drop sensor but I leave it set there. Bill acceptor is MEI Series 2000 24V Coin mech is a MEI Series 4000 with 6-pin although it appears to only use 5. Again, the customer is reporting when it fails it gets the "Remove product" message and they can shake the machine and it will return to functioning. Failure means it will not accept bills or coins. Any other suggestions? I know this intermittent behavior can be tough to diagnose. drop sensor thinks the product is still in the bin and wont vend another product. either turn off drop sensor, realign sensor or replace sensor Just saw this.... I will turn off the sensor tomorrow to test. Is the sensor in the bin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew0582 Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 may have to use a jumper harness to turn it off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZVendor Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Then it's a loose and out of adjustment vend sensor. There might be two of them so check them both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorris1953 Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Those pezo's can get very annoying. The first drop sensors where horrible about keeping lined up. There was no reference point as to where is was aimed. Lot of guess work. Route drivers were the biggest cause because they would stake product inside the door and cause them to misaligned. Just prior to the BevMax coming out the finally came up with a fix. A sensor with a red laser so you could center on the reflector . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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