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I there such thing as an MDB conversion?


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I got lucky, the first route I bought was composed of mostly MDB Machines, and a bunch of Wittern 3500's. The guy knew what he was doing and his equipment reflected that - he was getting out of the business. 

The 2nd route I bought not so lucky, it was a sell-off of their non-MDB machines. 

Anyhow - is there such thing as an MDB conversion kit?

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Yes. To be specific,  You can buy kits that have small boards and convert the non-MDB signal to MDB, and there are kits that change the entire control board and allow you to make everything MDB. So one is a conversion of the signal, leaving the rest of the machine unchanged,  while the other option changes the board.  Some machines are capable of handling MDB with a proper harness. So the question is.. what are you trying to convert? 

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Hmm... Maybe my understanding of MDB is wrong. The reason I was surprised to find out it wasn't - it doesn't have an MDB harness on it. SO I assumed that it wasn't MDB. 

I was sort of under the impression that machines were either made MDB or not. SO is it possible that this machine is MDB, but just needs  a harness?

 

I will say: This machine is from a route I purchased where EVERYTIME I hoped something was, it always has been. I was surprised to discover (and possibly erroneously)  that machine wasn't... I mean this machine came from the same guy who gave me a route that basically contained only Wittern 3500's!

 

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Well, assuming it is a 3130, then those machines have been notorious for coming equipped with coinco mechs and validators in them.  If I were a betting man (which I am not because I am terrible when it comes to actual bets LOL), I would guess it has a Coinco 9302-gx in it which IS hooked up with an MDB harness and it also has a coinco BA32SA or something similar, but I guess it could also be a BA30SA.

Here is what you need to know about MDB.  MDB is a protocol.  It is to a vending machine what USB is to a computer.  A computer could have a serial mouse or keyboard or a USB mouse or keyboard OR a mixture of the two as long as the motherboard supports those devices.  If I am not mistaken, the F80 board was capable of connecting to a coinco BA or MAG validator or any MDB validator (including the coinco BA and MAG as they could connect either way if you had the right adapter harness).

So, if my suspicion is correct, then you may just need to add an MDB validator, make the coin mech (very likely a 9302-GX) connect to the validator, and make the validator connect to the harness that goes to the board (instead of the coin mech plugging in directly to the harness that goes to the board).

Next time you're there, look to see how the coin mech is hooked up.  If it's a 6-pin MDB harness, then you just need an MDB validator and you're good to go (as long as it has the MDB harness coming off the validator).

To clarify, some older machines aren't capable of using MDB, such as an AP 110 series or older, a National 147/148 or older, and anything without a board.  There are ways around it but it's much costlier than simply buying a harness, and you might not get all of the data you'd like if you plan on pre-kitting (I am referring to converting older machines to use MDB and use a card reader).

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Almost certainly a red display.  You have pretty much what I assumed you would have in that machine.  The Mag32SA in it should have an MDB adapter harness (a Y harness) coming out of it but I think that machine was also capable of hooking up to the coinco validator with a red plug too.  Either way, you're all set as far as I know.  Here's something to keep in mind though... if you plan on adding a card reader, I don't think that machine will report cash sales.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/9/2017 at 7:49 PM, AngryChris said:

Well, assuming it is a 3130, then those machines have been notorious for coming equipped with coinco mechs and validators in them.  If I were a betting man (which I am not because I am terrible when it comes to actual bets LOL), I would guess it has a Coinco 9302-gx in it which IS hooked up with an MDB harness and it also has a coinco BA32SA or something similar, but I guess it could also be a BA30SA.

Here is what you need to know about MDB.  MDB is a protocol.  It is to a vending machine what USB is to a computer.  A computer could have a serial mouse or keyboard or a USB mouse or keyboard OR a mixture of the two as long as the motherboard supports those devices.  If I am not mistaken, the F80 board was capable of connecting to a coinco BA or MAG validator or any MDB validator (including the coinco BA and MAG as they could connect either way if you had the right adapter harness).

So, if my suspicion is correct, then you may just need to add an MDB validator, make the coin mech (very likely a 9302-GX) connect to the validator, and make the validator connect to the harness that goes to the board (instead of the coin mech plugging in directly to the harness that goes to the board).

Next time you're there, look to see how the coin mech is hooked up.  If it's a 6-pin MDB harness, then you just need an MDB validator and you're good to go (as long as it has the MDB harness coming off the validator).

To clarify, some older machines aren't capable of using MDB, such as an AP 110 series or older, a National 147/148 or older, and anything without a board.  There are ways around it but it's much costlier than simply buying a harness, and you might not get all of the data you'd like if you plan on pre-kitting (I am referring to converting older machines to use MDB and use a card reader).

I bought some machines, mentioned in my first post - that I "thought" we're all non-mdb capable machines.... to clarify: Are you saying that I can buy a MDB harness for most machines - and THAT will allow me to install a CC reader? At this point, I am okay with cash sales not being reported.... I.E. I have one account that has 3 machines upstairs - it NEEDS some CC readers.... but I didn't "think" they were capable... I hope I'm wrong!

 

The ones in Red I REALLY want to put a CC reader on....

12 select Royal Can/Bottle Coke rvcc804-13   (multi selection)
 
Dixie Narco Bottle/Can - looks like the on in the pic - pretty sure it's a single price though
 

Rowe 4900

 

Vendo 630 - 868931 115v

 

AP SNackshop 6600

 

DNCB 440

 

USI3014

 

 

machine at s.jpg

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MDB conversion kits taking a factory micromech machine to MDB is not worth the trouble because faking the micromech logic board into using MDB slows the coin mech down dramatically.  There are conversion logic boards for many controller machines but not all and I wouldn't invest that kind of money into Rowe or USI 3014/3015 machines.  There is also no reason to put MDB on a single price machine when so many multiprice soda machines are out there.  Single price has it's place and it will perform well in those instances.

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1 minute ago, AZVendor said:

MDB conversion kits taking a factory micromech machine to MDB is not worth the trouble because faking the micromech logic board into using MDB slows the coin mech down dramatically.  There are conversion logic boards for many controller machines but not all and I wouldn't invest that kind of money into Rowe or USI 3014/3015 machines.  There is also no reason to put MDB on a single price machine when so many multiprice soda machines are out there.  Single price has it's place and it will perform well in those instances.

It should have been a flag when the first thing the guy told me was "are you a current vending company? I said yes, but not big. He said "good, because we won't sell to big companies" - and gave me the yada yada yada sales BS. The real reason he won't sell to a big company is because no big company is interested in another company's "junk!!". 

 

What about that Royal machine, I would LOVE to put a CC on that machine.... any idea? 

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The Royal 804 is already MDB so yes, you can put a card reader on it.  There might be difficulty mounting it though without a kit to replace the point of sale sign with a card reader bracket though.  The 804 is a Marketing Machine which means it has the POS signage on it.

What do you mean by "the guy told me"?  Who won't sell to large vending companies, the route owner?

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You can't ask them to remove the GFI because it should be there for a reason.  If it's in a room where one outlet of the circuit is near a sink then code requires the GFI circuit. The GFI should be replaced with another if it has tripped many times because they weaken with too many trips.

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Actually,  what I was saying is that some machines are capable of accepting MDB components with a simple MDB harness because they are already capable due to the board. Some machines are too old and the board cannot. In that case, you need to upgrade the board if it's possible. The work-around is a special conversion kit but I haven't used them. The conversion kits are rather expensive, around  $200, plus you have to buy the coin mech.

 

You have to ask yourself if it's cheaper or better to upgrade 20 year old machine with kits that might never be used on other machines or if you should use the money as a down payment on a newer machine. 

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Fantastic. You  have given me enough info. to at least go out knowing a little bit about what I'm doing!  

 

I hear ya on the board comment... here's a a thought... 

*I have one account where the machines are upstairs (including the Royal aforementioned). The snack machine does VERY well, with a lot of requests for a CC reader.... I don't think paying someone to remove the machine downstairs, and put a new MDB machine back upstairs sounds like a financially smart move...

*The snack machine is a Royal 4900, and the Royal aforementioned is there.... based on another post of mine, it sounds like the Royal has a clogged condenser

 

PERHAPS, if I have to have someone come over for the Royal machine, I could also have them replace the Rowe board while they are there. It could be a 2-in-1 day learning session for me. 

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That's a difficult  decision. I do believe you can get a new aftermarket board for the rowe, and you can then upgrade the validator and coin mech and add a reader, you'll have troubles getting parts in the long run. Even an upgraded AP 7600 would be a better machine. But it's a lot to move.  It may not seem like a good move to pay someone to do that, but it also depends on what you think "really well" is.  You'll spend a minimum of $400 to upgrade the board, plus maybe $300 for a validator and coin mech, all in a machine that hardly has parts available. So.. say $700 in upgrades... you could probably get a used AP 123 or a used National 167 for less than $1500.  You could also just put an AP 7600 in there and invest the money in that instead + moving expenses. You're looking at pleasing your customers tomorrow, but what about 5-10 years from now? If a transformer goes out, you might lose a lot of money...

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The cost to move machines up and down stairs is very expensive so you should keep those machines working if you can.  The last stairclimber guy I knew charged $5 per step and $10 per landing and doing it up and down could make this cost prohibitive.

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