Hoping some of you can provide me with some support since USAT refuses to...?

[Sgolembiewski0903]

My USAT rep today was a valley girl...

I had some questions for her that she kind of answered but ultimately I give the conversation a 3/10 on what I was hoping to understand...! Maybe ya'll can help?

1) I have some errors on my dashboard... one if that I have two G8 readers with 150 days w/out a cash transaction. She said this would be a machine issue and not a reader issue, the machines are a USI Model 3129 and a Wittern 3500 BC500.... All my other BC500 machines w/ G8's show cash sales, so I have my doubts about her answer...

2) I've got 4 devices that haven't had a driver fill, (they were unusued for a while) I wanted to see about how to do a "driver fill" but she told me not to worry about it since I don't use DEX. I told her I wanted to learn, this upset her, so I told her nevermind... 

3) I have "

ePort DEX- SCC1, EC52: Bad Connection. Please check the cabling.

" 

on some machines... AGain I don't use DEX right now but would like to understand what this issue is... or maybe I'm getting ahead of myself??\

 

 

 

Thanks in advance for any feedback! 

[AngryChris]

2 hours ago, Sgolembiewski0903 said:

1) I have some errors on my dashboard... one if that I have two G8 readers with 150 days w/out a cash transaction. She said this would be a machine issue and not a reader issue, the machines are a USI Model 3129 and a Wittern 3500 BC500.... All my other BC500 machines w/ G8's show cash sales, so I have my doubts about her answer...

There is a very very high chance, like 99.9% chance that she was absolutely right.  Many USI machines were simply not designed in a way where the cash data can be sent through the card reader.  As I was told by a USI tech, if the machines are a GF series, or if they have an F80 board (which the 3129 does), then a card reader will absolutely not report cash sales and there is no way around it except for replacing the board.  That's USI's design at fault here and not the readers.. and it isn't an error, but just the fact that you can't see cash sales through the reader.  Having the USAT error telling you it's been so many days without a cash sale just means that it's been so many dales without cash sales being reported (because they can't be reported through that board).  The same is true for AP LCM machines with virtually identical boards (because USI made the specific boards in the LCM models with those boards.. even the programming is pretty much the same). 

If your CB-500/BC-3500 has the GVC board in it (which probably means it has the later style keypad with about 12 round buttons instead of something like 15 black/white square buttons) then that explains why they work fine.. because they are newer and designed to report cash sales.
 

2 hours ago, Sgolembiewski0903 said:

2) I've got 4 devices that haven't had a driver fill, (they were unusued for a while) I wanted to see about how to do a "driver fill" but she told me not to worry about it since I don't use DEX. I told her I wanted to learn, this upset her, so I told her nevermind... 

I have never used the fill option, but my very very basic understanding (if even accurate) is that you use the "fill" option essentially to reset data.. so basically you stock the machine and press the "fill" button so that the next time you get a report, it reports from the "fill" to the time you pull the report.  I don't know if this is true but it's just something I thought I read somewhere.  Either way, it should require you to have some way of accounting for what products are going in and what is coming out which can be done through USA Live (a little cumbersome to do) or through a VMS such as parlevel IF you already pay for the service.  If you have no VMS, then using USA Live is the only way.. and you need card AND cash sales to use it effectively.  Beyond that, I don't even know if the fill option is even necessary.  Someone else here should be able to tell you how that works and if it's even useful.

 

2 hours ago, Sgolembiewski0903 said:

3) I have "

ePort DEX- SCC1, EC52: Bad Connection. Please check the cabling.

" 

on some machines... AGain I don't use DEX right now but would like to understand what this issue is... or maybe I'm getting ahead of myself??\

That most likely means one of two things to my knowledge - either your male dex plug (from the telemeter) isn't properly connected to the female dex port in the machine OR the machine's current board and/or e-prom doesn't support sending dex.  If it's a board and/or e-prom issue that's preventing the machines from sending dex information, then the only way to solve that is to replace the board OR update the e-prom if that's possible.  On F-80 boards, you have to replace the board.  In a machine such as my Vendo 721, I just had to order an e-prom (which I haven't installed yet) and it should report perfectly after... cash AND card sales.

[lacanteen]

Chris is correct on all counts. Most USI machines do not report all of the data, so cash reporting is a function of the communication with the machine. Additionally, if you want to get DEX data for prekitting USI machines, you will need to map the selection ID numbers. For instance, A1 in the machine is usually 11 in the DEX file.

Driver fill feature is indeed a reset point for a VMS. You are telling the reader you have filled the machine. It also sends a manual DEX stamp is you wanted to see or use that data.

Your DEX error is exactly that. It sensed that it didn't get a handshake or data from the machine. Usually because the cable is unplugged, but it could be anything from an outdated EPROM, to a system error in the machine, or a bad machine computer board. 

As George Carlin once said "Don't sweat the petty things, and don't pet the sweaty things."  

[venddoctor]

1 hour ago, AngryChris said:

That's USI's design at fault here and not the readers.. and it isn't an error, but just the fact that you can't see cash sales through the reader. 

The F80 board is not a USI designed board it was an off the shelf control board made by Coinco and was used by Automatic Products, USI and 1 other manufacture that I can't remember now.

 

[AngryChris]

42 minutes ago, venddoctor said:

The F80 board is not a USI designed board it was an off the shelf control board made by Coinco and was used by Automatic Products, USI and 1 other manufacture that I can't remember now.

 

Thank you for the correction.  I do remember it being linked to coinco now.  In fact, I think there are some parts on the board that say coinco on it if I remember correctly.  Also, the F80 board is notorious for having a stock coinco harness.  If I had to guess the other manufacturer, I would guess Rock-Ola due to an educated guess (literally forum research here that you suspected yourself).  On an interesting note about that.. the board in the USI CD 7/5 appears to be the same (or similar) to that of the Rock-Ola's that I have operated, but these are 100% not F80 boards.  However, it's possible that Rock-Ola had a later model that used the F80 board but didn't get many machines out in the field.  I would imagine that whichever manufacturer it was, they didn't make many machines.

[venddoctor]

Yes I suspect Rock-ola as I know the other place it was used was in a can vendor and I had a photo at one time of one that appeared to have the F80 board.

 

[AngryChris]

If it is a rockola, it's literally one of the most useless factoids there could be lol. I mean, it's interesting, but still pretty useless.  It's unfortunate because rockolas seemed like well-built machines despite the serpentine design.  Whoever I had talked to at USI did inform me that replacing the boards on F80's, Snackmart 6's (if necessary), and perhaps the GVC1 (I don't remember if that was necessary) were very possible but I have a few older CB-500s with whatever boards are in there and I was told that those absolutely cannot be upgraded.  What I don't remember is if the CB-500's that I have can still handle a reader.  The tech made it sound like the F80 cannot use a reader at all but I think he was trying to say that it won't report cash sales at all.  I'm not worried about reporting cash sales at the moment, I am just adding readers left and right on my worthy accounts.

[Southeast Treats]

USI does not make it easy.... I have one machine with an F80 board that I replaced with a DEX capable board years back, an expensive undertaking.  The older GVC boards may not have DEX capabilities but they can be upgraded in the field with a USI updater tool and some research on the correct firmware version.  The cost of the tool is about the cost of a single board. 

[Anacapa Vending]

Bought that tool only to find out from Vendnet that it only works about 50% of the time! Beware!  Got them to refund me but it was a fight. 

[AZVendor]

4 hours ago, venddoctor said:

Yes I suspect Rock-ola as I know the other place it was used was in a can vendor and I had a photo at one time of one that appeared to have the F80 board.

 

Perhaps it was the last Cavalier machine made that had a logic board.  But what does it matter, it's only in the USI BC6 now and it's still limited, as are all USI boards.

[venddoctor]

18 hours ago, AZVendor said:

Perhaps it was the last Cavalier machine made that had a logic board.  But what does it matter, it's only in the USI BC6 now and it's still limited, as are all USI boards.

sorry AZ that isn't correct- the F80 board hasn't been used in current AP or USI models for years

 

[AZVendor]

I was just throwing that out there since everyone was suggesting that the F80 was used in just about every vending machine known to man.  Since I didn't know what Cavalier used I thought I'd include it too.

[Sgolembiewski0903]

On 2/26/2018 at 2:46 PM, AngryChris said:

There is a very very high chance, like 99.9% chance that she was absolutely right.  Many USI machines were simply not designed in a way where the cash data can be sent through the card reader.  As I was told by a USI tech, if the machines are a GF series, or if they have an F80 board (which the 3129 does), then a card reader will absolutely not report cash sales and there is no way around it except for replacing the board.  That's USI's design at fault here and not the readers.. and it isn't an error, but just the fact that you can't see cash sales through the reader.  Having the USAT error telling you it's been so many days without a cash sale just means that it's been so many dales without cash sales being reported (because they can't be reported through that board).  The same is true for AP LCM machines with virtually identical boards (because USI made the specific boards in the LCM models with those boards.. even the programming is pretty much the same). 

If your CB-500/BC-3500 has the GVC board in it (which probably means it has the later style keypad with about 12 round buttons instead of something like 15 black/white square buttons) then that explains why they work fine.. because they are newer and designed to report cash sales.
 

I have never used the fill option, but my very very basic understanding (if even accurate) is that you use the "fill" option essentially to reset data.. so basically you stock the machine and press the "fill" button so that the next time you get a report, it reports from the "fill" to the time you pull the report.  I don't know if this is true but it's just something I thought I read somewhere.  Either way, it should require you to have some way of accounting for what products are going in and what is coming out which can be done through USA Live (a little cumbersome to do) or through a VMS such as parlevel IF you already pay for the service.  If you have no VMS, then using USA Live is the only way.. and you need card AND cash sales to use it effectively.  Beyond that, I don't even know if the fill option is even necessary.  Someone else here should be able to tell you how that works and if it's even useful.

 

That most likely means one of two things to my knowledge - either your male dex plug (from the telemeter) isn't properly connected to the female dex port in the machine OR the machine's current board and/or e-prom doesn't support sending dex.  If it's a board and/or e-prom issue that's preventing the machines from sending dex information, then the only way to solve that is to replace the board OR update the e-prom if that's possible.  On F-80 boards, you have to replace the board.  In a machine such as my Vendo 721, I just had to order an e-prom (which I haven't installed yet) and it should report perfectly after... cash AND card sales.

I may have missed it somewhere in the thread, the machine does have

"If your CB-500/BC-3500 has the GVC board in it (which probably means it has the later style keypad with about 12 round buttons instead of something like 15 black/white square buttons) then that explains why they work fine.. because they are newer and designed to report cash sales."

...So it should be reporting cash sales?

All of my CB-500's came from the same "batch" (I believe)... I think they're all the same... which confuses me about why this one isn't reporting them! 
 

[AngryChris]

To my knowledge, there are three different boards for the cb 500.  There's the oldest ones and they should all have black and white keypads (you'll recognize them from newer styles) and those boards do not report cash sales.  There is the gvc1 which may or may not report cash sales (round black buttons).  And there is the gvc2 board which should report cash sales.  I'm not sure about the gvc1.  Also, you might need a dex harness for them.  The absolute BEST way to determine this is to write down every board model number (i don't know how to identify them, I don't own any GVC's) and call USI with those board models.  There should be serial numbers somewhere on the boards.

[AngryChris]

I'm sorry to break it to you, but USI model numbers don't mean as much as you think.  The serial numbers on the cabinet and board are everything.  They reuse the model numbers for different series and even use different model numbers for machines that might be more similar to a machine with a different model number.