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New To Vending, Advice On Machine Purchase


krylon80

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Hey All,

I'm new to the world of vending and I just wanted to make sure that a soda machine I was considering buying is decent and worth the asking price. It's a Dixie Narco 504P. I would only be using 12oz cans in the machine. The compressor is in good working condition. I think the coin mech and validator are also in good working condition, but they may not be based on the issues that the seller has been having with the machine (listed below). The asking price is $500, but I think there is room for negotiation if I'm armed with more info. 

Some selections give false "sold out" readings when they're not
Some slots jam every few sales
Occasionally gives wrong change or no change

I'm not sure what is causing these issues, but I plan to look into fixing them if I buy the machine. Even tough I'm new to the world of vending, I'm pretty handy. I've attached photos of the machine as well.

Thanks for any input you can provide!
 

 


 

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Nope.

The P series were notorious for various issues and gremlins, including the ones you are describing.

Run away, you will spend way too much time fixing this.

If you just want cans get an old single price machine.

Or if you want a newer machine find a 501E. The E series Dixie Narcos predated the P series, but are rock solid reliable workhorses.

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was using royals, never liked dixie, Seaga was horrible, Gaines are workhorses, and then I found vendos! love them! easy to set up, easy to run, parts available and cheap, I get them for about $250 to $350 tops used, with plenty of life in them, with very minor repair.

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The BEST way to get started, in my opinion, is by sticking with either Royal 650/Merlin IV or Dixie Narco 501e's.  Keep in mind that a 501e is very different from a 501T or 501MPC or anything else that it might say.  You want a 501E with an SIID board in it.  With the Dixie 501E or Royal 650/Merlin IV, you'll have all of the capacity and versatility you would need for almost any account that you'd be able to land as a new vendor.  They are usually readily available used or refurbished, and you can actually buy the Royals new to this day as they still manufacture them (not the case with the 501E).  I recommend new vendors stick with Dixie 501E's because they are easier to learn and you can transition to telemetry usually with no issues whereas older Royals might not report cash sales (this only affects you if you want to pre-kit, which requires a $300 card reader and $8/month wireless fee). 

Don't do Seaga, definitely don't do Gaines, no Antares, and a few other brands.  There are other models too that are older and very good, but a lot of markets have 501e's and Royal 650's readily available for purchase and you will kind of future-proof yourself with those models.  USI is okay too but many of their machines have pros and cons which can be a pain to deal with sometimes.  Vendos are also good but, as a general consensus, you want to know what you are doing with vending because vendos can be problematic in certain ways.  In fact, the only 2 series I would recommend you ever touch are the vmax (540, 720, and a few others) and the v21 series.  The v21 is an excellent series but they DO have some problems at times (like all other machines) which can be somewhat difficult to figure out... and being new means you won't have a clue.  There are SO many knowledgeable people that can help you diagnose a Royal or a Dixie and that's the only reason why Vendo moves down the rankings a bit.  Also, certain USI soda machines are 100% incompatible with card readers and will not function whatsoever.  One model I KNOW will not work is a CB-500 (aka CB-10, BC-10).  However, only the model that have the MCB12 board in it are of issue.  The models with GVC boards are fine.  You'll know what it has based off of the actual model number (USI 3189 is the CB-500 with an MCB12 board and will NOT work with card readers.  The USI 3500 (as the model number should say on the sticker) should have a GVC board and be fine.

As for snack machines, there are many models you can go with because there are so many kits, but at this point, if you can get your hands on them, stick with machines of certain generations or newer.

AP 4000/5000's, don't bother.  Don't bother with any AP machine that doesn't have a digital display either.

AP 6000/7000's are VERY good machines given how old they are, and they have made many vendors a LOT of money.  They are probably the best workhorse snack machines ever made, but they are old and need to be upgraded to accept new technology.  That can be done, but if you can get something newer then that's great.  

AP 110's are also VERY good machines for their time, but the same issues exist with them.  In fact, they have a lot of important advantages over the 6000/7000 such as how the validator mounts and where the coin mech is.  They are much easier to repair in my opinion, but they need the same money invested as the 6000/7000 and might not be as common in your market.

AP 120s are good machines too but have some issues.  If you get a working AP 120 with a drop sensor, then you are good to go.  If a board goes bad on it, the simple solution is to buy a retrofitted board for about $315 + shipping and taxes.  Anything newer than an AP 120 is probably a "good" AP machine but parts can be issues at times because of a history probably related to being bought-out by Crane, and I don't know the details of that history.

National 145/146's were also workhorses, but I highly recommend you dodge these machines. 

The same is True for the National 147/148's.  They all made a lot of money but I wouldn't even bother with those.

National 157's are good machines but sometimes need some upgrades.  The upside is that they are good machines and only require an MDB harness, maybe a new E-prom, and probably some programming change to make them MDB capable if they aren't already.  We are talking about $50 if even necessary.  The downside is that not all had drop sensors and to add one will usually only be cost effective by buying a retro kit that includes a board and drop sensor for $415++.  But a drop sensor isn't really necessary and there is nothing wrong with getting a National 157 if the price is right.

Anything newer than the 157 is usually a good machine for National, and I only know of snack models going up to 160/170 but I don't know the differences in those models.  There are also GPL's that look almost identical but they can have various amounts of differences between them.  It's difficult to say whether you should bother with GPLs or not because it depends on what's in them and I don't even know.

USI machines are difficult to even talk about.  The easiest way for me to explain this is by saying this:  Unless the machine is VERY recent and has a GVC board in it, you might not get cash sales reported if you want to pre-kit in the future.  That's often not a big deal, especially for new vendors, but it can matter later on because it's the way of the future in many ways.  If a machine has an F80 board in it, you WILL NOT get cash sales.  If it has an SM6 board in it, you MIGHT get cash sales.  If it has a GVC board in it, you SHOULD get cash sales.  Regardless, anything with an F80 board, SM6 board, or GVC board in it will be a decent machine.  Don't get anything older than those.  For model numbers and some details, you can go to vendnet.com and look through their snack machine manuals list.  You'll see details on what boards are in what models right there.

AMS has also been in the market for a little while (not as long as the other guys) and they make good machines but older models often require costly upgrades.  You can probably stay away from any brand not mentioned here.

As you can see, there are a lot of models.   One of the EASIEST ways to quickly check to see if a machine is even worth messing with is to see if it is already setup for MDB.  Sticking with newer model machines is your best bet, such as AP 120 or newer, National 157 or newer, Dixie 501e, Royal 650, etc..  Any of those models will accept a card reader, should already be MDB, and there are many people out there that know how to diagnose them when you have problems because they are all very common machines.  It MIGHT cost you more to buy these but it might not.  Buying refurbished will, of course, cost more than buying used but a company with a good reputation can provide you with excellent machines to get you moving.  Having good machines that are relatively future-proof will mean that you won't have to go through many of the pitfalls that many of us have gone through over the past 10,15,20, or 30 years.  I promise you that there are many more vendors out there than you realize and the bulk of them only have a handful of accounts and often don't keep up with technology because they can't land decent accounts to justify the upgrade.  Don't be like them; start with the right equipment first, and don't buy new machines until you get your feet wet.

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11 hours ago, AngryChris said:

The BEST way to get started, in my opinion, is by sticking with either Royal 650/Merlin IV or Dixie Narco 501e's.  Keep in mind that a 501e is very different from a 501T or 501MPC or anything else that it might say.  You want a 501E with an SIID board in it.  With the Dixie 501E or Royal 650/Merlin IV, you'll have all of the capacity and versatility you would need for almost any account that you'd be able to land as a new vendor.  They are usually readily available used or refurbished, and you can actually buy the Royals new to this day as they still manufacture them (not the case with the 501E).  I recommend new vendors stick with Dixie 501E's because they are easier to learn and you can transition to telemetry usually with no issues whereas older Royals might not report cash sales (this only affects you if you want to pre-kit, which requires a $300 card reader and $8/month wireless fee)....

wow, lots of great info there, thanks!

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