Warehouse comparison

[AngryChris]

I may be securing a warehouse in the coming few months.  I have two available in my area and both are just partitions of a larger single building.  One is 3,000 SF with a large overhead door (probably 10 feet) but no dock.  The other one is 2,000 SF with a large overhead door on one side (maybe 12 feet) and a dock on the opposite end.  I am leaning toward the 2,000 SF building strictly because I am under the impression that a dock is going to make things a lot easier for me, but maybe I am putting too much value on a dock for my size.  Having 3,000 SF is obviously nice because I have more room for growth but I don't know if it's really worth losing a dock.  The other thing is that the building with the 2,000 SF warehouse has a much better setup in the sense that it looks really easy for trucks to come and go.  Would a 2,000 SF warehouse with larger overhead door + dock be better than a 3,000 SF warehouse with just one overhead door?  Also, is it common practice to allow me to just transfer my lease into a larger unit in the same building if it became available?  Both cost about the same and the 3,000 SF unit is only slightly closer.

[Southeast Treats]

My current warehouse is smaller with no loading dock.  I would like to have a little more space as I have grown some, but the lack of a loading dock has not been an issue.   My distributors are well set up for ground level deliveries, and I specify lift gate service for the occasional large freight delivery.  We use a utility trailer for machine moves so again no loading dock.  I would focus on how much space you actually need rather than rent a space just to get a loading dock. 

As far as lease transfers, that is something you should ask your landlord about in advance.  I would not assume they would agree if it is not written into the lease; and that still presumes the other space will be available when you need it.  Balancing the amount of space you need vs the rent you can afford is a business decision that requires a lot more info.

[AngryChris]

I know it's not an issue because almost every distributor I use for anything has a lift gate, but it just seems like it would make things so much easier to get in and out.  Maybe I should go ahead and secure the larger one since it's supposedly available now and just work with that.  How big is your warehouse?  Is any office space included?

[orsd]

Docks are not the most useful thing on earth, if you don’t get a bunch of freight. Most suppliers use lift gates and even if you move machines a lot you’ll be needing a lift gate anyway when you go take it off the truck. In any case I would much rather get the bigger space and buy a used forklift for 3-4K if I find myself needing that capability often. The only reason I would want a dock is if I ran my route with dock height trucks. Or I sold a lot of machines that get shipped freight.

[AZVendor]

The dock is just a convenience and if you aren't getting LTL deliveries of freight it won't really matter if you have one or not.  3000 feet will give you lots of room for growth and to store things you won't need to store at home now.  Moving a business out of the home is very advantageous and professional, if it make financial sense.  

When I had my largest building it had a dock that was used by Coke, Pepsi and our snack distributor but they also had liftgates so again, the dock didn't matter.  I had a front reception area that I stored stuff in so people couldn't look in the window and see what we did, I had my office, a money counting room alarmed separately from the rest of the building and then I had a room for keeping candy and pastries cool since the warehouse stayed over 80 degrees most of the year.  All of the office space was air conditioned.  We parked our three trucks and van inside to prevent vandalism and we still had room for two full truck loads of soda and the storage of way too many machines.  Parking the trucks inside was the reason for all the space since it was cheaper than any fenced-in facility I looked at.  There had been two rollup doors side by side until one of my trucks took out the divider wall so we put up a 20 foot wide rollup door that solved that problem.

[Southeast Treats]

12 hours ago, AngryChris said:

How big is your warehouse?  Is any office space included?

right now I only have about 1200 sq ft, half under air; with a small office and a restroom.  I am doing about 200K a year in sales and thinking about expansion if I get any bigger.  It's pretty tight but doable if I don't try to store too many machines. 

If you are moving from a home base operation to your first warehouse, remember to budget for all of the new expenses, not just rent: utilities, building maintenance (your lease should detail what is your responsibility), and any additional insurance you might need.  It put a big dent in my profit margin but was worth it in the long run...

[orsd]

Yep. Make sure what kind of lease it is. NNN leases or triple net mean that you pay property tax, maint. and insurance as well. There are other types, but leasing commercial property is very different from an apartment.

[Golfdogs]

I've literally just moved into a new warehouse space.  25x80 with a 12' overhead door.  550sq/ft of office space and a bathroom.  One office is all shelving for snacks.  common room is all freezers and a desk in another office.  I did cut in a double door to the warehouse portion so I can get pallets in and out of the office space.  both my Isuzu trucks with 16' boxes fit into the warehouse. More shelving for chips and beverages. I can store about 24 machines.  It's tight, but it works!  No dock, but I can borrow a forklift from some neighbors, if needed.  

[AngryChris]

1 hour ago, orsd said:

Yep. Make sure what kind of lease it is. NNN leases or triple net mean that you pay property tax, maint. and insurance as well. There are other types, but leasing commercial property is very different from an apartment.

I've never even rented an apartment so I can't compare lol.  I bought a house when I was 23.

There is also a building for sale for 65k but it's only about 1300 SF.  It's a huge upgrade from my garage and it's only a block from my house but I don't know if it makes sense or if I could even get it financed.

[AngryChris]

3 minutes ago, Golfdogs said:

I've literally just moved into a new warehouse space.  25x80 with a 12' overhead door.  550sq/ft of office space and a bathroom.  One office is all shelving for snacks.  common room is all freezers and a desk in another office.  I did cut in a double door to the warehouse portion so I can get pallets in and out of the office space.  both my Isuzu trucks with 16' boxes fit into the warehouse. More shelving for chips and beverages. I can store about 24 machines.  It's tight, but it works!  No dock, but I can borrow a forklift from some neighbors, if needed.  

That's pretty much exactly the dimensions of the 2000 SF facility.  I only have maybe 10 machines in my garage but I have access to a lot more.  Having said that, you make it sound like I could easily outgrow the 2000 SF facility with the plans I have.  On top of that, it turns out the dock is in the inner corner of the building.  If someone is using one dock, they'll block the other, and it looks like people like to park trucks against the dock so that could create unnecessary frustration and render the dock useless at times.

[Golfdogs]

The smaller space is going to make me pare down some of the extraneous stuff.  I simply can't keep that old CS 12 anymore. I'm planning on vending 5 more years and I am getting out, one way or the other.  So, this is just a step in that direction.  I had access to 10,000 sq ft at my other warehouse.  Now, it'll take me several loads to the recycler to part ways to stuff I've held onto for several years.  Anyone need parts from an AP Snack shop 5000?!?

 

[AngryChris]

2 hours ago, AZVendor said:

The dock is just a convenience and if you aren't getting LTL deliveries of freight it won't really matter if you have one or not.  3000 feet will give you lots of room for growth and to store things you won't need to store at home now.  Moving a business out of the home is very advantageous and professional, if it make financial sense.  

When I had my largest building it had a dock that was used by Coke, Pepsi and our snack distributor but they also had liftgates so again, the dock didn't matter.  I had a front reception area that I stored stuff in so people couldn't look in the window and see what we did, I had my office, a money counting room alarmed separately from the rest of the building and then I had a room for keeping candy and pastries cool since the warehouse stayed over 80 degrees most of the year.  All of the office space was air conditioned.  We parked our three trucks and van inside to prevent vandalism and we still had room for two full truck loads of soda and the storage of way too many machines.  Parking the trucks inside was the reason for all the space since it was cheaper than any fenced-in facility I looked at.  There had been two rollup doors side by side until one of my trucks took out the divider wall so we put up a 20 foot wide rollup door that solved that problem.

After reading all of the responses, I am going to strongly consider the 3,000 SF facility for growth as you mentioned.  The overhead door looked to be about 10 feet high as I checked today (but didn't bring a measuring tape, doh!).  My van is under 9 feet tall so that's not an issue, and I think even the high top vans are well under 10 feet.  I am currently operating (not well) in a 360 SF garage so 3,000 SF is a mega upgrade.  On one hand, I feel like I wouldn't know what to do with 3,000 SF but I am sure I would once I have it...

[lacanteen]

20+ routes, no dock needed. Hackney body loads drinks from ground level. Forklift for freight. Nuff said.

[AngryChris]

Thanks everyone.  I think I should try to settle on the 3,000 SF facility and go from there.  We have lost a lot of vendors in the last 5 years and, although I am sure there are a lot of part-timers out there, the majority of the local companies are owned by aging people who probably also want to get out soon.  The rookie vendors are trying to live solely off of combo machines and they keep settling for small locations and convince themselves that it's okay to break even in 5 years.  With the job market being the way it is, I think every big vendor out there is having huge problems stocking all of their machines... and you know that means they'll sacrifice service to the smaller locations first.

[SCOTT1963]

good choice, take the space

[Southeast Treats]

One other benefit of moving out of the house, I stopped drifting back into work stuff all night long!  Sounds like a good plan, good luck!

[Anacapa Vending]

On 11/24/2019 at 10:42 AM, AngryChris said:

I've never even rented an apartment so I can't compare lol.  I bought a house when I was 23.

There is also a building for sale for 65k but it's only about 1300 SF.  It's a huge upgrade from my garage and it's only a block from my house but I don't know if it makes sense or if I could even get it financed.

65k to buy a shop? You guys dont realize how good you have it! Our rent is almost $40k a year for 3,300 sq feet. Next year it'll be 3% more...