Fire destroyed the location.

[putrevus]

Hi All,

Thankfully nobody got hurt .

I need your help in figuring out what I should  do next, there was fire yesterday afternoon destroying the whole building where we have 4 machines Two Snacks Crane 167s,Two Vendo 721s. All of them had credit card readers all of them went offline suddenly.

I went there in evening but was not allowed in the building, the some worker said all four machines might have burnt down too.I have not spoken to the management of the facility yet.

Does liability insurance cover anything like this.

 

Thanks for your help.

[allen watson]

It depends on your policy. Mine jade a provision for loss of equipment and business interruption.  Call your insurance provider and explain the situation 

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, allen watson said:

It depends on your policy. Mine jade a provision for loss of equipment and business interruption.  Call your insurance provider and explain the situation 

Should I ask the location to cover for my damages???

[allen watson]

That’s your call. If it were me, I would check with my agent first. Maybe they will have recommendations 

[putrevus]

On 12/17/2019 at 6:43 PM, allen watson said:

It depends on your policy. Mine jade a provision for loss of equipment and business interruption.  Call your insurance provider and explain the situation 

I spoke to insurance company and liability insurance does not cover any property, BOP covers property damage  of your warehouse and loss of revenue if machines breakdown.

If they have to cover for machines in different locations, they need information on those locations and their buildings and  codes that too they were not sure , they will have to talk to underwriters for that after I fill out all details of every location where machines are placed. I have liability insurance from Hartford Insurance.Am I missing anything,

The location told me that the building is still very unsafe to enter but are pretty positive that everything got destroyed and are very sorry for the inconvenience.

I don't know what I am supposed to do next.

[allen watson]

I'm So sorry for your loss. Thanks for the information regarding how your policy works. I always assumed that it would cover stuff like this. 

[AZVendor]

The location's policy should cover you since they gave you permission to install the machines there.  If you have any agreement with them that will help but only to convince a court that permission was granted.  In any event, unless you could prove that they were brand new machines they will probably be depreciated down to zero by their attorney.  If they try that then you can easily prove by the sheer number of machines and their ages still in operation that the life of a major brand machine is 20 years or more.

[putrevus]

3 minutes ago, AZVendor said:

The location's policy should cover you since they gave you permission to install the machines there.  If you have any agreement with them that will help but only to convince a court that permission was granted.  In any event, unless you could prove that they were brand new machines they will probably be depreciated down to zero by their attorney.  If they try that then you can easily prove by the sheer number of machines and their ages still in operation that the life of a major brand machine is 20 years or more.

That's what I was thinking, I am just waiting for them to let us in.We did not do anything wrong , why should we suffer on account of their mistake.That is down side of this business we are at the lowest end of the spectrum where everyone can walk all over .

[AZVendor]

Everyone is at the bottom when it comes to insurance payouts.  You aren't/won't be singled out.  Any vendor to that building like computers, copiers, coffee equipment, etc will be in the same boat as you.  You aren't special and you aren't being discriminated against either.  Just wait your turn.  I don't see where you are being walked all over.  The building is unsafe and no one can go in it yet.  You won't get in until the investigation is complete and maybe not at all if they have to raze the building for safety reasons.

[Southeast Treats]

just my understanding, I could be wrong, but unless you had an agreement with them that required them to add you to their insurance as an "other named insured" or " as the interest may appear", their insurance will not cover you either.  You would have to seek payment directly from the account and that may be impractical.  They have suffered a large financial loss themselves in spite of insurance and may not have the resources even if they desired to do so.  A lawsuit for your damages would not be a guarantee and likely would just enrich the attorneys.  

In my experience, insurance companies want to charge such large premiums to insure machines on locations that it is not financially viable to try and do so,  It's one of those risks you accept and fortunately the losses are not frequent.  I have had machines broken into with extensive damage and it's not fun, but I knew it could happen and worked thru it. 

As an aside, be glad you do have liability insurance... if the Fire Marshal determines the fire started anywhere near your machines, their insurance company may come calling to offset their losses.  I hope that's not the case!

[AngryChris]

1 hour ago, Southeast Treats said:

just my understanding, I could be wrong, but unless you had an agreement with them that required them to add you to their insurance as an "other named insured" or " as the interest may appear", their insurance will not cover you either.  You would have to seek payment directly from the account and that may be impractical.  They have suffered a large financial loss themselves in spite of insurance and may not have the resources even if they desired to do so.  A lawsuit for your damages would not be a guarantee and likely would just enrich the attorneys.  

In my experience, insurance companies want to charge such large premiums to insure machines on locations that it is not financially viable to try and do so,  It's one of those risks you accept and fortunately the losses are not frequent.  I have had machines broken into with extensive damage and it's not fun, but I knew it could happen and worked thru it. 

As an aside, be glad you do have liability insurance... if the Fire Marshal determines the fire started anywhere near your machines, their insurance company may come calling to offset their losses.  I hope that's not the case!

My insurer wanted me to provide a list of every location and their value.  I asked why and they told me so they could "insure them" if something happened.  The thing is, I realized that the premiums would have likely been insane so I quickly told her that I just wanted general liability for damage caused by my business... I didn't want to insure the machines.  It may happen some day, but I think it's unlikely that the additional premium costs would ever make up for the cost of equipment.  If it was a single location with a large bank of machines, I might reconsider that but I am self-insured as far as it goes now.  She quickly asked me if I was sure because "What if your machines get broken?" but I told her that most of my machines are only worth less than $1,000/each so, unless a massive disaster wiped out the entire city area, I could afford to suffer the loss of a couple machines.  Sure enough, some tornadoes came through and destroyed a lot of businesses.  A 276E got dirty and the 3014 that was next to it got destroyed.  I haven't lost a wink of sleep over the loss of the 3014.

[putrevus]

On 12/20/2019 at 10:59 PM, Southeast Treats said:

just my understanding, I could be wrong, but unless you had an agreement with them that required them to add you to their insurance as an "other named insured" or " as the interest may appear", their insurance will not cover you either.  You would have to seek payment directly from the account and that may be impractical.  They have suffered a large financial loss themselves in spite of insurance and may not have the resources even if they desired to do so.  A lawsuit for your damages would not be a guarantee and likely would just enrich the attorneys.  

In my experience, insurance companies want to charge such large premiums to insure machines on locations that it is not financially viable to try and do so,  It's one of those risks you accept and fortunately the losses are not frequent.  I have had machines broken into with extensive damage and it's not fun, but I knew it could happen and worked thru it. 

As an aside, be glad you do have liability insurance... if the Fire Marshal determines the fire started anywhere near your machines, their insurance company may come calling to offset their losses.  I hope that's not the case!

Happy New year to all, I am yet to go to location as they have not yet said it is safe to enter the building. This location looks like it is fire hazard and has a big fire every few years. 

It was very decent location , we had it for 3 plus years but even if we take bottom figure it will cost me $4500.00 to replace existing machines with card readers. 

Trying to figure out what is the best way to approach this issue.

[Southeast Treats]

It has a fire every few years???? OK then.... well, if you do replace the machines when they reopen you might look into some limited type of coverage for that location only.  The good news is that it will take them a while to rebuild so you don't have to run out and buy machines today, you can start saving towards the goal.  Are you able to get bottler machines at all?  That might be a way to go that would reduce your upfront cost and your loss exposure, use bottler drink machines and just buy a snack machine....

[orsd]

Single price Dixie and a National 147. LOL.

But if they truly do have a fire every couple years then I don't foresee them staying in business much longer. Eventually no insurance company will want to touch them.

[putrevus]

1 hour ago, Southeast Treats said:

It has a fire every few years???? OK then.... well, if you do replace the machines when they reopen you might look into some limited type of coverage for that location only.  The good news is that it will take them a while to rebuild so you don't have to run out and buy machines today, you can start saving towards the goal.  Are you able to get bottler machines at all?  That might be a way to go that would reduce your upfront cost and your loss exposure, use bottler drink machines and just buy a snack machine....

Thanks for your reply.Money is not the issue, I can spend money to get the machines ..As you said is there anyway I can get coverage for machines just for this location and general liability for other locations. Will bottler be okay if the machine is lost in fire?

[flintflash]

17 hours ago, putrevus said:

Thanks for your reply.Money is not the issue, I can spend money to get the machines ..As you said is there anyway I can get coverage for machines just for this location and general liability for other locations. Will bottler be okay if the machine is lost in fire?

I've had bottler machines sawed in half, stolen and dumped on the side of the road, and lost in a fire.  They don't come back on you because it's a "cost of doing business".  Most of their equipment gets written off the books(depreciated) quickly, so they just eat it.  As far as getting insurance for the equipment, realistically it doesn't make economical sense.  We used to have insurance on our equipment for damage; covered up to $5000 per location (if there were multiple units placed), but after a few years I dropped it.  Situations like this where you lose your equipment to a fire or some severe situation is pretty rare.  The amount of money that you will pay annually for the policy will end up being more than if you just by the replacement machine.  Unless you are in an area where your equipment is getting damaged on a regular basis and/or stolen, economically it just doesn't make sense.  It's good in theory, but really, your looking at $1000-$2000 to by a decent used machine to replace this one.  Take the loss and move forward.  I would seriously think about this account though, if fires are a habitual thing with them.  Maybe do as some of the others have mentioned and have them add you as an "Additionally Insured" on there insurance policy.  That's pretty common practice.  Good luck with the situation.  You may catch a break and have your equipment listed in the "Damage" and recoup some of your losses from their insurance company, but I wouldn't press hard on the issue if you are planning on keeping the account.  I have had losses covered in the past (as a pleasant surprise), but we never demanded compensation from our accounts.   

[putrevus]

When I talked to them in the beginning of the year, they said building will not ready for a month but  some of the employees have told they got machines form new vendor, I am so angry, they won't even let me into the building but they get new vendor.All we did was give them excellent service not one complaint from anyone in last three plus years and they do this to us.Where is fairness in this world.

[fhamann]

Putrevus,

Sorry to hear that they replaced you as the vending service.  That is the risk we take in this business.  We can give perfect service to our locations, but we can be asked to leave for any or no reason at any time.  I have noticed that once the decision has been made to replace, there is very little chance we can convince them to reconsider.  The amount of investment we put into the location is irrelevant.  We cant let that bother us.  It is just the business we are in.  Every time I acquire or buy an new location I am gambling that I can hold on to it long enough to make it worth my while.  The more expensive the location, the greater the gamble.  We must take this into account in how much we are willing to invest.  Vending only works if your locations last a long enough time.

[putrevus]

Just now, fhamann said:

Putrevus,

Sorry to hear that they replaced you as the vending service.  That is the risk we take in this business.  We can give perfect service to our locations, but we can be asked to leave for any or no reason at any time.  I have noticed that once the decision has been made to replace, there is very little chance we can convince them to reconsider.  The amount of investment we put into the location is irrelevant.  We cant let that bother us.  It is just the business we are in.  Every time I acquire or buy an new location I am gambling that I can hold on to it long enough to make it worth my while.  The more expensive the location, the greater the gamble.  We must take this into account in how much we are willing to invest.  Vending only works if your locations last a long enough time.

I am not worried about losing the location but their fire destroyed our machines and they didn't have decency to inform me.