Royal G3 troubleshooting repair options

[Nepherael]

Hi guys 

After placing my first machine, an old dixie narco that multiple people here helped me understand the best way to go on upgrading the coin mech and add a bill validator (haven't added yet), I'm moving on to a Rotal G3 I picked up.

 

Quick rundown:

It looks to have been worked on extensively. New cooling deck, door switch has been removed (it's just a wire that I can connect and disconnect at will if I need door menu), etc.

It will not accept money at all. Through 2 troubleshooting sessions here's what it does:

- upon first power up the bill validator (ba30b) gives me 5 red light blinks continuously for a short period and then light goes blank. Does not operate again (was surprised the light worked again days later in the next troubleshooting session. Same thing, no light after a minute or two)

- bill validator seemed to run its motors one time in the first troubleshooting session (it functioned longer the 1st time) but never again

- coin mech (9302-GX) has solid red light as it should. Coin payout buttons work for a few seconds when first powering on. Coin payout works when doing it through the machine service menu (using the selection buttons on the front) even after the manual buttons stop working. This is with no change in it 

- machine shows only one error code (it showed many. I reset them all and none have come back except this one) FRIG SENS. This is the temperature sensor. It does not have a temperature sensor attached to the control board and is sensing manually through a control know inside the machine.

- when removing bill validator from harness no change in Coin mech. Still does not accept money

 

 

My question: based on this does it tell you where I need to start? All the internal vend tests seem to work. Buttons work.

If a bill validator is disconnected should the Coin mech operate the machine?

Would this temperature sensor error stop the machine from accepting money? 

If not, is there something internally in the settings I could be missing before I start spending hundreds on new coin mechs and validators

 

Thanks everyone! 

Edited May 4, 2023 by Nepherael

[AZVendor]

That's a lot going on.  The coin mech plugs into the validator harness so did you leave the coin mech not plugged in?  If the coin mech has a red light behind the acceptor then it should accept coins.  If it doesn't then if nothing is pressing down on the coin return of the mech and there isn't gunk on the coin track then you need to get the coin mech repaired.  It sounds like the validator is bad too since you said the coin mech light was on and there was change in the tubes. However, the coin mech in an MDB machine has to have correct coin counts in the mech so even though there are coins in it the machine might not think so, disabling the validator. You should upgrade it to a VN2512.  The thermostat in place of the temp sensor won't cause the machine to not work but I would replace the temp sensor as it should have been done to eliminate the possibility that the temp control isn't installed properly.  You should also replace the door switch so the machine behaves correctly.

[Nepherael]

9 hours ago, AZVendor said:

That's a lot going on.  The coin mech plugs into the validator harness so did you leave the coin mech not plugged in?  If the coin mech has a red light behind the acceptor then it should accept coins.  If it doesn't then if nothing is pressing down on the coin return of the mech and there isn't gunk on the coin track then you need to get the coin mech repaired.  It sounds like the validator is bad too since you said the coin mech light was on and there was change in the tubes. However, the coin mech in an MDB machine has to have correct coin counts in the mech so even though there are coins in it the machine might not think so, disabling the validator. You should upgrade it to a VN2512.  The thermostat in place of the temp sensor won't cause the machine to not work but I would replace the temp sensor as it should have been done to eliminate the possibility that the temp control isn't installed properly.  You should also replace the door switch so the machine behaves correctly.

 

Thanks for this. I need to correct some things

 

The coin mech did not have change in the tubes during testing. Will this inhibit function?

 

As for the harness my harness can plug into coin mech without bill validator if I want to. The harness from control board just Y's with 2 matching plugs . I can go control board > bill validator > coin mech or I can go control board > coin mech 

Since both plugs were all on the same wires I figured I could try just the coin mech. Didn't accept anything. I'm thinking I could replace the coin mech and bill validator but my bog concern is this may end up being a small internal wiring issue or the control board

And just to confirm: will the FRIG SENS stop function at all? I would think not but just curious 

[AZVendor]

You do need coins in the coin tubes for the bill acceptor to work. DOH! The Y harness direct to the coin mech is fine. Most people remove it with the bill acceptor out of habit. The FrIG message won't cause anything negative.  It's just a warning.

[Nepherael]

19 minutes ago, AZVendor said:

You do need coins in the coin tubes for the bill acceptor to work. DOH! The Y harness direct to the coin mech is fine. Most people remove it with the bill acceptor out of habit. The FrIG message won't cause anything negative.  It's just a warning.

Thank you. I will fill the coin mech and see if this changes anything and report back. 

Haha, as I said, I was hoping it was something small. Let's see if I get lucky. I believe you offered me guidance on my last machine. I really appreciate everything thus far!

[Nepherael]

Following up on this. Coins in the coin return still same result. Power to bill validator for less than a minute, coin acceptor solid red light. No money accepted. 

I'm thinking next step is a new bill validator?

My concern is that all of this is fine and what I actually need is a new control board but all the tests I'm doing on the control board (in the setup menus) are working fine 

Would a machine like this work with the bill validator detached and just a coin acceptor plugged in? If so, then my issue is bigger than a bill validator because it also doesn't work in that config.

Thanks for any advice! 

[tblake05]

Before spending any more money on this one....

does your board have a “snaphat” battery like this?

measure the voltage on it.

 

[Nepherael]

On 5/8/2023 at 7:20 AM, tblake05 said:

Before spending any more money on this one....

does your board have a “snaphat” battery like this?

measure the voltage on it.

 

I will check it. I have a similar chip that just says "timekeeping RAM". Doesn't say battery. I'll check it out. Although I'm not losing any settings. It is retaining the price and everything.

Edited May 10, 2023 by Nepherael

[AZVendor]

Try unplugging the bill acceptor and just running the coin mech then try another coin mech if that doesn't work.  Something is disabling the coinage which could be an empty machine, a bad door switch or a specific error code.

[Nepherael]

I have an update on this:

 

I couldn't figure it out and was about to chalk this up as a full electronics replacement, including logic board. I decided to go back to individual troubleshooting. 

 

I got the coin mech working! I disassembled the flight deck. I wiped the sensors with my finger, barely, and took the back off the flight deck. There were thin copper wires going to magnets. I don't know if maybe they were touching back of the circuit board in there causing a short? Either way all I did was finger rub the sensor area and take that back off. Put it back together and I'm golden. It takes coins and vends! (Although, weirdly, the buttons don't match any configuration in the sticker attached to the door)

 

After that all I have is the bill validator. Today I was able to get power to it for a much more extended time than in the past. It gives me 5 blinks. I've cleaned the optic sensors. However, the manual says a 5 blink might mean a bunch of other errors (supposed to power cycle to activate these other codes) so I have that to worry about. Eventually it powers down again though. Says in the manual "check L6 opto circuit on main board" if no light. I have no idea how to locate this. 

Another thing is the harness. I need to trace the wires down but it just doesn't seem wired the same as other harnesses I've seen. It Y's off of the same wires going to the coin mech. Maybe this isn't an issue but seems off (maybe they just rigged a harness 🤷‍♂️)

 

So that's where I'm at. A CoinCo BA30B that will give 5 blinks and eventually fully power down with no light. Hoping to repair it over replace. Willing to put the time in. Have a feeling it is doable. Any suggestions

Edited May 17, 2023 by Nepherael

[AZVendor]

Oh, come on.  You need to replace the bill acceptor as it's ollllld technology and a VN2512 would be so much better.  The Y harness is correct.  The harness plugs into the machine MDB port then to the bill acceptor and then to the coin mech.  You'll need to change it to put a Mars validator in it though.  

[Nepherael]

12 minutes ago, AZVendor said:

Oh, come on.  You need to replace the bill acceptor as it's ollllld technology and a VN2512 would be so much better.  The Y harness is correct.  The harness plugs into the machine MDB port then to the bill acceptor and then to the coin mech.  You'll need to change it to put a Mars validator in it though.  

One thing I'm having trouble with is knowing what can replace them. I was concerned about cost but the model you recommended I've already found refurb for about a C note WITH harness so that's not bad at all.

I don't mind needing to get a new harness if I'm going to upgrade the bill acceptor. Better than buying another BA30B and being disappointed. 

Alrighty I'll probably fiddle with it one more time to satisfy my stubbornness then bite the bullet and just replace it 😆

 

I saw this guy had the same issue with one that he bought so I feel like there's a simple solution that I'm missing. Like not enough change in coin acceptor or something (I'm not sure where the sensors are in it. I'm also pretty sure it doesn't have correct change lit)

https://vendiscuss.net/topic/30403-am-i-missing-something/

Edited May 17, 2023 by Nepherael

[AZVendor]

It's obvious that you don't have any vending machine experience so just accept our advice.  Look at how long we've been in the business and then think about what we know and you don't.

[Nepherael]

1 minute ago, AZVendor said:

It's obvious that you don't have any vending machine experience so just accept our advice.  Look at how long we've been in the business and then think about what we know and you don't.

Hey no issues there. Your advice has been the only way I've gotten through these last two machines 👍 followed every suggestion so far

[tblake05]

If your getting 5 blinks, the machine is enabling the validator (ie there is enough coins in the changer) and the validator itself has an issue. Otherwise, the red led light on it would never turn one- therefor not blink.

Time to just change it out. all my failed coinco validators (and coin mechs for that matter) get replaced with mei. Problem solved.