Persistence pays off!

[WillisNYC]

Back in July I walked into a 200 person office that was decidedly unhappy with their vending services.    I found a daunting opportunity since they wanted a cold food and ice cream machine on their location in addition to the 2 glass front soda machines and 2 snack machines.  They had a different vendor they were happy with doing the coffee service.  I was VERY new in the business at the time having only 3 soda and one snack machine in my total route at the time.  This would be a significant addition to my route if I could get it.

The office manager proved to be difficult to crack, but I kept in touch with him and finally got the approval today.  It was really just a matter of continuing to follow up with him and providing him wth continued assurances that I would keep a cold food machine on premises and freshly stocked twice a week.    The same went for the ice cream machine.  Their current ice cream machine had product frozen to the spirals EVERY time I visited this account in the last couple months.  The current vendor had also removed the cold food machine. 

Now to make good on my promises and find cold food that this account will actually purchase and justify the cost of this account.    This account is too big for me to let fail.  It is also a no commission account which is huge for me since my best current accounts both have commissions!

[mission vending]

Congrats, that's a big win for you.

Look at getting set up with Vistar or one of the vending supply companies in your area. They have a large variety of cold food products that will be delivered to you frozen, so you can thaw as needed. I don't think you will find enough selection at Sam's to keep them happy.

A few suggestions to get you started;

1. Hot pockets (Chef America)

2. Bridgeford brand products

3. Don Miguel brand products

4. Landshire brand products

5. Pierre brand products

All of these have 14-30 days after thawing

Another suggestion is to look around in the local convenience stores find out what brand of prepared food they sell and get the contact number from the manager. It shouldn't be difficult to arrange to meet the guy every other week somewhere for an extra cash sale. Deli Express is a big player in this market.

[WillisNYC]

Thanks mission.

There is a 'gut truck' supplier nearby that provides fresh food for those trucks daily.  I am planning on starting with them.  Sams and BJs near here definitely did not have the selection that I was looking for.  I ate the gut truck sandwiches for a week and they were all quite good in the sample 12 pack that they gave me.  The frozen to fresh stuff I will try if this supplier does not go over well.  Sams does have a great ice cream selection that I will be featuring in that machine though. 

[mission vending]

Around here we call them "roach coaches"  . Lot's of reason for concern here....... Been there. done that.

How is his stuff labeled? Does he have the ingredients listed? What about the nutritional label? How is the packaging? Is he packing in a nitrogen environment to inhibit mold and bacteria? How does it taste after 3days, 7 days? There is a big difference between stuff made for today's consumption and something that might sit in a cold food machine for a week.

Not trying to burst your bubble on the exciting new account.....What happens if the ingredient label is missing or wrong and someone has an allergic reaction to something? How much liability insurance do you have? How much does he have? Buying from someone like that isn't necessarily a bad thing, you just have to be more careful that's all. The larger companies that make this stuff for freezing and distribution to vending companies are very precise and exact about what they are doing, this individual might not be and that could potentially put you in a very uncomfortable position in the future.

[WillisNYC]

I 'sampled' a dozen of this suppliers sandwiches over a week's worth of time.  They tasted just as good at 3 days and at up to 7 days after I received my samples.  I plan on putting a small amount in the cold food machine every three days for at least the first few weeks.  My wife and I get to eat whatever is left after 3 days until we get sick of that.  Both the supplier and the account are a short drive from my house so doing this first thing every Monday and Thursday morning is my plan for the near term.  I will adjust based on sales from the cold food machine.  If I break even in sales from it I will be happy.  Anything over that is gravy.  I really am only putting this machine on the account in order to get the location.

As for your other issues.  I have a million dollar liability policy.  No idea what the supplier has.  The supplier does have a VERY large operation.  I was in his warehouse and was quite impressed with the size.  He does not list all the ingredients on his packages.  Nor is nutritional information listed.  I can ask him about the nitrogen environment, but considering how fresh the product was after 7 days, I would guess he does.  I was impressed with how good the sandwiches were even after a week and I don't intend to leave them in the machine even that long. 

[coinvestor]

If you pull cold food items after 3 days in what sounds like a white collar location you will loose lots of money. Buy them frozen, thaw as needed. I get 14 days out of Landshire brand sandwhiches from Vistar. When they expire, I eat them and they still taste great.

JD

[WillisNYC]

You may very well be right Coinvestor, but I am going to try to limit how much I put in the cold food machine from the very start.  It is a white collar location and I don't expect the sandwiches to do all that well.  I really am just aiming to break even or better of course in this machine.  If I am pulling too much food after three days I will let it ride for a full week and then pull it.  But I want to start with three days and see how it works out. 

[sbishop]

If I break even in sales from it I will be happy.  Anything over that is gravy. 

As are most cold food vendors.

You do not want the machines to look empty. I would put in energy drinks if you can not vend them from your soda machine. Also, Juices, fruit, jello pudding packs(they last along time) and any thing else that has a long shelf life.

The guy I bought my route from was selling Denty moore microwavable meals that you find on the shelf in walmart and not in the refrigerated section.

[coinvestor]

As are most cold food vendors.

You do not want the machines to look empty. I would put in energy drinks if you can not vend them from your soda machine. Also, Juices, fruit, jello pudding packs(they last along time) and any thing else that has a long shelf life.

The guy I bought my route from was selling Denty moore microwavable meals that you find on the shelf in walmart and not in the refrigerated section.

I just looked at a canteen account like this the other day. The only selections in the machine were fruit cups and Chef Boyardee cups. Its a shame to see accounts like this. These accounts do not deserve a cold food machine, they are just sitting there to meet contractual agreements.

JD

[WillisNYC]

yes Kelly, this forum has been awesome for me, full of ideas and help.

Speaking of help, coinvestor, what do you suggest?  The current vendor pulled his cold food machine and screwed up the rest of the account by servicing it only every two weeks.  It obviously should be serviced once a week.  The ice cream machine was a spiral one where the ice cream was always getting stuck to the spirals.  They also put cheap off brand colas in the glass front and had over half a dozen rows that didnt vend properly.  One of the two glass fronts had the non vending rows. 

I promised them the cold food machine that they may not deserve.  However I will be there at least once and twice a week to start.  I expect to make good money on the snacks, soda and ice cream machine.  I don't want to put cold food items that dont need refrigeration in the cold food machine.  I also don't want to lose much money in an account that probably cannot properly support a cold food machine.  The account can easily support these other machines and as a small operator, I truly need a good, large stop.  Should I have not have promised them the cold food machine that they probably don't need and then not gotten the account?  I am anxious to get the experience with a larger account and also with cold food and ice cream.    The account will get FAR better service than what they have previously experienced so I think we all win.  (Even the large vendor that is out of an account that they clearly do not care about.  My theory is that they did  not make as much money as they anticipated, so they slowly let its service degrade.)

[coinvestor]

Willis,

Let me say, I have laid in bed many nights saying "why did I say I would do that". Every day I try very carefully to reduce the amount of things I say that I kick myself for later. While I still do from time to time I do it much less frequently. With that said, I always do what I say I will.

If this account called me, I would explain to them what you already know and said (but I will rephrase). The other vendor is not stocking the cold food machine because it is not making money. The amount of sales from the remaining equipment is not enough to cover all the equipment (which there is too much of), equipment maintenance, and good service. Is short, the location is not profitable for a vending company. No matter how good your intentions are if an account is not profitable, the service will degrade. Tell this to them. They are not working for free, and should understand that you won't either. I have had accounts thank me for explaining it this way.

The only way to fix service issues in an account like this is to correct the amount of equipment on site and reduce the amount of capital to acquire the account (IE make it profitable again). I think that I would have tried to put a frozen machine with ice cream and food in it. This would give them the food they wanted, and reduced the amount of equipment you had to buy.  I would not  try to talk them into this now since you committed otherwise. Just understand that you may eventually end up as I mentioned above, with a cold food machine with long shelf life products in it.

An account this size will probably do about $400 to 450 a week (total drink, snack, and food). I m not real sure how many machines you need to buy, but I would make sure that you can still make money. Buy refurbed when it makes sense to.

JD

[WillisNYC]

Never fear coinvestor...EVERYTHING I buy machine wise is refurbished.  I love old, refurbed AP7000s.  Get em for $600-$750 refurbed.  I am buying my first glass fronts, bottle drop type for this account, $500 for a used one and $1200 for a totally refurbed one just pulled out of another vendor's account.  FastCorp 431 refurbed for $1700 and $2300 for a Rowe cold food machine.  Assuming $400/week I will net $800/month.  Thus, allowing the account to pay for itself in 9 months.  That is a little longer than I hoped for, but is within the parameters that I expect when putting together an account.  The account would be paid off sooner if Coke had cooperated and placed a glass front for me in this location.  Alas, they refused to do so and I am buying one more than I anticipated.  This gives me more flexibility though and I ultimately will like this result more though.    (I am also hoping with a little tweaking to hit $500/week with this account.  If I do then I will be thrilled!)

[coinvestor]

So how many machines total?

2 glass front drinks

1 fastcorp frozen

1 cold food

1 AP 7000?

What kind of glass front drink machines are you getting refurbed for $1200 each? I would stay away from the Rowe cold food machines. I just gave two away last week to a scrap dealer for free as long as he hauled them. I would not pay $2300 for a machine this old that you are sure to have part availability issues with.

Be careful, cheapest is not usually the best route (this is my opinion that others will disagree with). I know this sounds like I'm double speaking, saying to not spend too much, and don't spend too little. I don't run any machines that are as old as the ones your looking at, and sure wouldn't spend 7-8k for them. To me machines this old are a liability racking up headaches and repair cost and draining profits and customer satisfaction. Either a location will support MDB type machines that were made within the last 7-8 years, or its not a location I'm interested in.

JD

[WillisNYC]

2 AP 7000s total is what I am placing.    One of the glass fronts I picked up on Craigslist as part of a package deal for $500.  The other one is refurbed for $1200.  The cheap one is currently placed and working.  The owner is selling his service station and the new owner wants the machines gone.  It works fine and I have a good repair guy if it is not working perfectly.  Prices for machines made within the last 7-8 yrs are roughly twice what I am paying.  If I wanted to wait 2 years for a location to pay for itself, I could 'invest' in more expensive equipment.  I don't have enough experience so far to know how long I can expect to hold on to spots.  No I am not doing long term contracts that can just be broken anyway.  However, if what I am doing works, why change?

I have been buying all my equipment used or refurbed.  So far I have had minimal problems.  You sound like a much bigger operator than I am.  I don't intend on buying newer equipment until I am much larger.  I have been targetting small to medium size businesses for the most part.  I have also attacked some larger locations, but this is the first one to come through for me.    So far things are working out fine with my smaller locales. 

What are MDB type machines?   

[mission vending]

Willis,

Let me say, I have laid in bed many nights saying "why did I say I would do that". Every day I try very carefully to reduce the amount of things I say that I kick myself for later. While I still do from time to time I do it much less frequently. With that said, I always do what I say I will.

JD

Whew, I thought I was the only one around here that had that problem.

Agreed, do what you promised with a smile. Give it three months, track your sales with all machines and your spoilage losses. Then go in and have a sit down with them and show them that if the cold food is not working why it's that way. Most reasonable people won't have a problem if the vendor would simply explain things to them instead of simply pulling up with a truck one day and announcing that you are taking the cold food machine out because you are not making money. If they insist on having you keep it there for whatever reason use it to get a price increase, commission reduction, even a subsidy from the location to make it work better for you.

Be careful with going into these larger types of accounts with older equipment, buying stuff cheap doesn't necessarily mean it's a good value, especially if you lose the location in the first year with breackdown issues.

[coinvestor]

What are MDB type machines?   

MDB is Multi Drop Bus. It is a standard for the communication between the changer, validator, and control board. For the most part any changer or validator that is MDB is interchangeable in any MDB machine. MDB will also make it easier if you ever decide to DEX. Going from memory MDB was an adopted standard in 1996, so any machine after should be MDB.

Having all MDB machines will allow you to buy one extra changer and one extra validator and have a spare for any of your machines.

JD

[Poplady1]

I am getting in here a little late but I notice you are buying both a ice cream unit and a cold food.  Have you considered doing what almost 99% of other full line vendors are doing right now and buying a frozen food unit.  That way you can stock your ice cream and food in one unit.  You only buy one unit plus you will eliminate the out date problem.

Even Sams sells enough product to properly stock a frozen unit.  All they need is a couple of microwaves and a condiment stand. 

Blue Moose

[WillisNYC]

That suggestion sounds like a reasonable idea Poplady, unfortunately it is a little late. (I already promised them both machines.)  What frozen food unit would you recommend for this type of setup in the future?  Would the newest Fastcorp have sufficient capacity? 

[Poplady1]

I would try to keep my cost down and use something like this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Fastcorp-820-Frozen-Ice-Cream-Vending-Snack-Food-Machin_W0QQitemZ130336875702QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Vending?hash=item1e58aee4b6

Hope you get the link.

Bev