Guide to refurbishing machines (with PICTURES)

[lurtsman]

This thread will hopefully serve as the posting grounds for a guide on refurbishing machines. We have several people who know how to do it, and I'm not one of them. My refurbishing is mostly just washing.

I recall seeing a refurbed super 80 on here in black and thinking "I want to buy that!". I've now purchased several used and neglected machines. They are in serious need of a revamp before I put them out on location. Paint is pealing off, and rust is showing. (but at less than 5$/pop for oaks, can you blame me? Deal found by Nam)

Seeing the beauty that could be restored gave me hope that I could learn, and make these old machines shine like beauties once again. I believe effective refurbishing allows for a much greater RoI because many run down and neglected machines are available for pennies on the dollar.

I welcome anyone to bring in their ideas, understanding that I plan to use these ideas to improve my profits. When I'm done, hopefully this thread will end up in vending 101.

Monday is delivery day for the rest of the 24 old machines + old racks. It may take me a while to get this done, as I will have several new second hand machines also. (gotta love oak vistas still in the wrapping) My first priority will be getting the new machines out on location. Then I will use the advice from this thread to refurbish the machines, taking pictures as I go. Then I can post each step, accompanied by the picture -- will probably need steve to insert them for me, I'll use a camera phone to keep it low resolution.

The major problems for these machines are:

Rusted center pole

Rusted stand

Rust on some parts of the machine, such as around the area where the globe touches down.

Pealing paint near the bottom, around the globe, and inside the globe around the candy wheel housing.

Stickers stuck to the globe, in some cases there is masking tape that appears to be baked on by years in the sun (as best as I can tell--this is more an issue with some other machines I'm repairing, but I need to be able to fix it)

Tiny problems are:

The plastic feet that go around the bottom of the racks may be coming apart (1 definitively is). I plan to solve that by putting a piece of electrical tape around it.

The globes have a dingy look to them, perhaps just from being old.

The strengths are:

To the best of my knowledge all the coin mechs work (they said that all of them did)

All metal housing

Quality manufacturer

Black should be a convient color scheme for refurbishing.

To the best of my knowledge, they have keys for all the locks

The guidelines are:

Bandaid fixes are excellent. The band aid is cheap, it applies to several situations, and it allows people to continue on for a long period of time. Therefore the bandaid provides excellent RoI. (Talking about actual bandaids there, though I would not want to put a literal band aid on one of my machines. I'd use tape.)

We want to make the machine look visually appealing to the location and to customers.

The workmanship for cleaning around food areas should leave the product safe for our customers to consume.

RoI is king. Think cost effective, and practical. We want to avoid having to acquire several specialty tools, but we also want to make refurbishing quick and painless. Assume all people involved have ratchet sets/screw drivers/ability to purchase cleaners in small amounts, and paint.

When suggesting a product, try to be specific suggesting where it can be acquired, how much it costs, and what acceptable alternatives would be. If you feel one particular form has a significant advantage, explaining that advantage would strengthen the guide. For instance: What kind of paint should we use? Is Spray paint good enough? I could disassemble the machines, lay down a tarp (which I currently do not own), and just spray all the pieces I wanted done. In the event of paint, if you also have information such as how long it takes to dry, please feel free to include that.

Your pictures are welcome also, as long as you understand hundreds of people may view the contents of the final "guide", if you want a picture omitted, please say so.

All right, lets get down to exposing the information of of refurbation. (I'm astoned that's a word, but mozilla likes it)

[kai1836]

Hey first of all congratulations on a really good deal! Second this is a great idea for a thread. The center rod rust can be ground with a wire wheel brush or maybe even brushed with steel wool. As far as repainting and the rust on the stands I'd sandblast or get a handheld angle grinder with a wire brush attachment and go to town. I took some pictures of the last batch I sandblasted. I'm going to do a full line machine this weekend. I'll take some more and put them all up.

[lurtsman]

Sounds great Kai. I've got a wikipedia open on sandblasting to learn about it tonight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandblasting

For anyone else in here learning. What is a hand held angle grinder with a wire brush attachment? (pictures maybe, with estimates on cost and where you would get one) I've noticed that the old machines had metal in the candy brush housing, virtually everything is metal, and they were flooded for a long time--apparently while in the basement during the flood of 2008.

As far as I can tell everything is functional, but considering the septic water that may have been sitting in them, rusting them, it will be hard to get them up to my standards for holding food.

[chris in md]

What is a hand held angle grinder with a wire brush attachment? (pictures maybe, with estimates on cost and where you would get one)

sears has a good selection of tools, as do lowe's and home depot.  you can even get them off of amazon.  harbor freight sells a lot of inexpensive tools, of varying quality (sometimes questionable quality).  i've had mixed results with HF; some of their stuff is fine, some of it completely sucks.  like anything, you get what you pay for.  all of the above mentioned sell online, and all but amazon have storefronts you can go to to check them out in person before buying.

your better names are gonna be makita, dewalt, craftsman (sears brand), ryobi, black & decker, milwaukee.  any of those will be good tools.  pretty much anyone who makes power tools makes angle grinders.  you can also get pneumatic angle grinders, but that's overkill for a gumball machine.

here's a few pics...

angle grinder:

wire brush attachments:

 

[chris in md]

now that i re-read the main topic, for refinishing gumball machines, an angle grinder might be too big.  you might be better off with a drill; the wire brushes should fit in the chuck.  for more detailed work and smaller nooks and crannies, a dremel tool would be great, though your sandblasting cabinet should be able to take care of those spots.

- chris

[JPVendCo.]

I find to get the best finish, (I have not done this with machines but with computer cases, you don't remove rust from plastic,lol) knock off the big chunks of paint with a chemical stripper and just a hand wire brush. then start with a course grit sand paper, and work your way from course to fine grit until you have a fairly smooth surface.

[lurtsman]

Great ideas in here. Thanks for the pictures to. I may swing by the store and look at the products first hand, check prices, and make plans to visit the local garage sales looking for some power tools.

[kai1836]

Power tools are a good thing!

[nam]

These angles grinders are a very handy little tool. I would avoid the harbor freight power tool section. I have bought misc. things there but a lot of junk from China with really inferior quality. Also as far as getting in smaller tight spaces the air angle grinders are much smaller and work great if you have an air compressor. I also use a Dremel power tool with flexible shaft and very small little attachments that get in tiny spaces.

The big angle grinders are great for cutting off bolts. The ATM's always had to be anchored to the floor. I used a hammer drill to drill holes down into the concrete and then pounded special ATM anchors in each corner. Each one designed to hold like 10,000 lbs of pressure and you have one in each corner to prevent someone from being able to yank it out. Sometimes pull the bumber off their truck before the bolts would break. Alot of fun doing installs and if you ever had to remove the machine it would leave these big bolts sticking up out of the floor several inches high. So had to carry one of these angle cutters to cut those bolts off and try not to distroy their floor. Those big bolts might not break very easy but boy one of these angle cutters would cut a bolt into really fast and easy.

One of the key things to remember in using any of these tools like the grinders with cut off wheels or wire brushes is to always wear safey glasses! The grinding and cut off wheels can break sending pieces flying into you! Sparks and pieces of metal, paint, etc. can come flying and hit you right in the face.

nam

[lurtsman]

To some degree I've avoided using power tools for the business because I have no health insurance. I may make some use of smaller power tools in cleaning, but to a great extent will use elbow grease over electricity. On the upside, it has helped me stay in shape

Long term, power tools are clearly the solution because my limiting factor will be time rather than money. Short term, knowledge and ability are my most limited factors. Within 6-8 months, I'm hoping money is the limiting factor (though I'm expecting sales around 700$/month by then), and I'll be growing quickly. If I land a full time job, time will be the limited factor, and the use of locators and power tools will become more important.

A year from now I see myself having a small but growing arsenal of tools, and being very adept at refurbishing machines. I see working with old machines as a large part of my future in vending, because I love getting the cheap prices on used equipment.

Lets key in on one of the issues. Cleaning the plastic windows. How do you get rid of tape/stickers that have been baked on through several years? This will be a frequent theme for many people who buy used machines. It comes up with different answers in the forum searches. What are the best products--and why is that product superior? If one product is heads and shoulders above the rest, where should someone go to buy it? How much should they expect to pay? Does it require wearing gloves, should it only be used outside? I LOVE learning.

Edit agian:

For anyone following this wanting additional reading on the topic of removing stickers:

http://www.vendiscuss.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=1547&forum_id=1&highlight=removing+stickers

http://www.vendiscuss.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=996&forum_id=1&highlight=removing+stickers

This one isn't really related, but is good recommended reading:

http://www.vendiscuss.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=533&forum_id=1&highlight=removing+stickers

The most recommended products there are goo gone and WD40. I will of course report my own experiences.

[pdavid]

lurtsman,

For the globes that are really shot, I've just ordered new ones from Northwestern. They're only $8 a piece.

[lurtsman]

That's really not too expensive... have you had any experience ordering replacements for the oak vistas? (With 4 plastic pieces instead of 1, it should be much cheaper)

I tried WD40 last night, and it worked out okay. Between that and some finger nail work I managed to take off any areas that had bumps. The rest is just going to remain I think, and I'll put that front on a toy machine instead of a candy machine.

[shvend]

Lurtsman,

I hope I am able to cover everything in this post that I am hoping to but I am sure I will miss something and will have to add later.  

75 to 90% of all the machines that I locate are refurbished.  If I can get a picture to fit on here I will take a picture of my shop to prove it.  I have a found a very good way to refurbish machines for very very very CHEAP.  It is all done by hand and using nothing but a few basic hand tools, sink, brillo pad, razor blade, and a can of spray paint. 

I have several of these machines you are speaking off and first off they are very good machines.  You made yourself one heck of a purchase.  But to start off get yourself a table where you can work.  If you have a garage this would be the best place for this to happen due to some small pieces you are going to have to take a part in these types of machines to get them apart. 

First off to start taking these machines apart you are going to find there are 6 main parts to these machines that will have to be cleaned very well. 

Once you take the lid off take the four pieces of plexi glass out and look down inside the machine at the product wheel and brush housing.  There you will see two small phillips head screws, remove the screws and you will be able to lift the wheel and brush Husein out.  After they are removed you will see 4 smaller fillip head screws in each corner of the machine toward the globe corner accent pieces.  To remove them you will have to hold the nut that is up under the hopper to remove them.  You may be lucky though and bought some that has the threaded rod.  After you removed those screws you will be able to seperate those two peices apart. 

Now you should be scratching your head by now saying what in the heck is this man making me do to my machines.  Don't worry it will be ok! 

From there it is pretty simple to disassemble the rest of the machine (WORD OF ADVICE DO NOT REMOVE THE CENTER ROD FROM THE BOTTOM MOUNTING PLACE IT MAKES REASSEMBLY MUCH EASIER).

Now you are looking at this pile of parts wondering what in the heck am I going to do now?  Am I right. 

Take one of the pieces of plexi glass and go down to one of the locale glass places and they should be able to cut you some new pieces for next to nothing.  Around here they cost me about $1 to 2$ a piece.  If have some that are ok you can slide them in the back and save some cash. 

Now is the time to go over all your painted parts and go over them with some fine sandpaper.  Take and sand off any rust you have and smooth up all rough parts of the paint.  After you are satisfied with sanding job go over the rest of the machine and just scratch up the panit. 

Now for the fun stuff.  Take all your parts and place them in a sink and grab your brillo pad we talked about earlier (don't worry the use them in restaurants to clean just about everything that touches your food).  Clean all the parts very well using hot water and rinse very well.  Make sure you don't leave no soap residue on the machines because this will effect the finish on the paint job we will be doing in a few minutes.  Lay the machine off to the side to dry while you start taking the next one apart. 

After the machine is dry and I mean DRY go out on your tarp or what ever you want the machine to set you on while you paint it.  Just a note you may want to find some old cheap table at a yard sale of something to set them on while you paint them it just makes the whole process easier.  Take and place some items under each part to paint to help left off the surface you are painting it on.  This helps make sure you are able to get the same color in all the joints and you have two different colors showing. 

Start your paint job with a coat of grey primmer and let set for about 20 minutes after you have completed the last part.  You use what ever color you want but I use Krylon Gloss Red, due to it just stands out. in a crowd of machines.  Start at a corner and with short burst go side to side until you get to the bottom.  You want to keep the amount of paint you put on these parts to a minimum due to the paint running.  Once you get the paint running on these parts you have to start all over again. 

I should have said earler the reason for the primer it just helps the paint pop a little more.  It really does brighten up the color and it also adds another layer of protection for the metal up under the paint. 

Carefully move these parts back inside and let them set for about 24 hours before reassembly.  This helps keep the parts from sticking together and your fingerprints from becoming embedded in the paint. 

Take your Coin Mech, thank you flaps, chute guard, product wheel and brush housing and If have not by now take and wash them also with a brillo pad in a sink with hot water.  Take the coin mech out as soon as possible and dry it down.  Let the other parts sit there and air dry they will be fine. 

Take the coin mech and set down because things are getting ready to become interesting.  A good working coin mech or what I call a slick coin mech is very important to your vending machines.  The reason being one that will catch and skip and beat around is not very fun for your patrons to play. 

I don't know if you have never taken one apart or not but I will go through the process anyways.  Looking at the back of the mech you will see the sprocket with a bolt in the middle of it and four bolts on each corner.  They are probably phillip heads but that is no promise on my part. 

First remove the bolt of the sprocket and removed the sprocket and the handle.  Then take and remove the 4 corner bolts and remove the back plate off the coin mech.  Don't worry there are no parts are going to fly off and get ya. 

Carefully remove the coin wheel and place a small amount of petroleum jelly on the back of the coin wheel and a small amount around both coin dogs.  This will help slick up the coin mech.  Place the coin wheel back in the mech and reassemble.  Now take a quarter a make a couple of dry runs to make sure everything went back together ok. 

For your rust on the center rod just take your sandpaper and give it a good sanding your should be able to get the biggest majority off of it. 

After your paint has dried for 24 hours you are ready to reassemble.  Start from the bottom up and you will have no problems.  If you have a stand place the bottom on the stand a secure using a bolt or screw of your choice.  After that put the coin box on the bottom and place the chute guard and Thank you flap on, then place the coin mech back in place.  When you put the coin mech on use care that it goes on straight or you risk the chance of scratching you new paint. 

Now place the product wheel and brush housing back in the hopper and attach with the screws that you took out.  If these screws show signs of rust or you just want new ones they are very cheap at any local hardware store.  Now place the globe section on your table upside down and place the hopper on top of it making sure all the pins go back in there proper hole.  Then run the screws back into place making sure you put the nuts on the bottom of the hopper.  This usually requires alot of finesse and a few choice words before you get them together.  After that place the hopper on the coin box. Go ahead and place  your plexi glass pieces back in there and add your quarter sticker.  Now place your lid on there and you are now finished. 

I would recommend placing some product in the machine a playing it a few times to make sure every ting went together nicely and there is no hanging in the parts in anyway.  You may notice the first couple of times you take the newly painted machine apart for service it will stick a little.  That is normal and will stop once the paint in the joints has become worn and thinned out a little.

I think this is a very good description of refurbishing this type machine.  If you have any questions while doing this I will be happy to help.  I have plenty of practice at doing this and they best way to learn is to screw up a few things and figure out what happened. 

Good Luck!

[lurtsman]

Great advice Luke. Easy POTD vote, this will be a solid walk through for refurbishing my machines. I especially appreciate the list of materials at the start so I can make my shopping list before I have these machines laying in pieces

[nam]

Luke,

lurtsman is right on your post being a POTD. I'd gave you a POTD too and would give you 2 POTD's if I could. Excellent detail to show someone that hasn't done it just what to do refurbing a machine. Thanks for taking your time to make that post.

nam

[sbishop]

got my vote too

[lurtsman]

I'm loving vending. I've got a huge list of things to accomplish today, more than half are at least vending related, and it feels great. I think having a job that is neither fulfilling nor high paying has given me a greater appreciation for running my own business. I am SO excited to do the refurbishing on these machines now that the steps are becoming clear. I'll probably read that POTD several times to commit it to memory.

[shvend]

No problem guys I just happen to be a geek in the world of fixing these old machines up. If you have any questions just ask.

[lurtsman]

How would you handle a rack stand that is heavily rusted? Can I use sandpaper on that to get the rust off, same as the center rod? It would appear at first look that these rack stands were originally chromed. I'll try to get up pictures tonight or tomorrow. Glad to have you watching the thread shvend.

[shvend]

lurtsman,

Yeah you can use sandpaper on it to get what rust off you can. After you get off what you can wash it good and paint it using the primer and a gloss black spray paint.

[lurtsman]

Sounds good.

Where should I go to get primer and spray paint? (I'm aware this is a relatively stupid question, however my biggest challenge to completing tasks is not understanding some small section of it. Once I get confused I stop making head way, so even the stupid questions I'll ask)

I've got a walmart superstore and a Lowes near here. There is a menards and possibly a home depot about 15-20 miles away.

[candyman_1984]

Wow,

Thanks for the run through. Just getting started.

[lurtsman]

Bought a bag of steel wool squares, a 320 grain sand paper block, and a can of spray paint. I should be ready to tackle some stands tomorrow.

Also, the machines I thought were oak vistas are actually some kind of eagle. I decided that was not going to be a big problem for me because eagle still made good machines. One of the new ones had a crack in the back though--these packages went through some challenges--despite the boxes having been unopened, they did sit in a basement and the bottom of the machines (still sealed in card board) had mold on them for me to clean off.

Goal is to have 2 sets of machines ready this week. If I over achieve I may get 3. Over all the new machines are ready to place except for needing the stands redone and needing product. (Air vending is very tricky) I wanted to try doing a bronze for the stands, I thought it would look slick with my shiny black machines. (And the paint was half price) 8.89 after tax. Got some ice cream to, but that's not included in the price

[shvend]

Well looks like you found the spray paint before I was able to get back to you, sorry about that. Oh yeah hope you enjoy your icecream we don't need to forget the small things!

[shvend]

Oh yeah the same instructions will work with the eagles they are pretty much the same thing!