Saeco SG 200 operators

[Greatdane]

I happen to be at the right place performing a HVAC start-up on a roof top unit at the VA clinic in the mall. After I was done, I stopped at the mall managers office and told her about my new gourmet coffee business. She wants two gourmet coffee machines placed in the center of the mall for their customers just like that. Was the easiest placement locating yet.

The mall has no food and only beverages is a couple Pepsi/coke machines. The coolest part is that there is no commission I have to pay. The manager is just happy to have anything that would allow customers to stay a little longer in the mall.

Once Walmart entered town, 1/2 the mall emptied. She even gave me a guarantee of 20 cups a day for each machine. Doing a little averaging math and that adds up to around $280 a week minus cost of around .285 cents a cup equals around $200 profit a week. Not to bad for 4 hours maintenance a week including travel. Two visits a week. Going to place them Monday. I wish Saeco would make a 70 mm 4 once cup for giving samples out.

[PerformaVending]

Something fishy is going on here.

[gosaz12]

Hello, my wife and I are new to this forum and are starting a vending business. We recently purchased a few SG200 Expresso Vending machines and while looking for spare parts and other information ran accross this forum. If you anyone could help guide us to where we can find spare parts and with the descaling procedure we would greatly appreciate it. Seems to be lots of other information about these machines that we have found but still struggling with these two. The machines seem very easy to operate and maintain so far so we are happy with our purchase.

[Greatdane]

So happy you found our forum. Glad to hear you chose Saeco 200's They are very reliable. Like buying the Cadillac instead of the Yugo. I too struggled to get information and service support for these coffee machines. They are very popular and very durable. One trick is to use clean mineral free water or you must have the water conditioner option plumbed in. Scaling is very minimal if you stay away from city water.

I did notice in the manuals that came with the machine, there is little mention of the descaling procedure. I have not done it yet. I do know if you are connected to city water, you want a water back-flow preventer just in case. All my machines are not connected to city water supplies so unlike your home coffee maker, I have not had to descale as the water I use from a underground spring tested better than bottle water. Testing cost me $95.00 but am very satisfied with the results. last thing I need is to spread ecol-i to the entire office. The bottling company uses the same spring I do, but I use the public tap.

I have heard from more operators and people like you, that have purchased these machines outside of the established way. If I can be of help, just post any questions you have. We can all learn from each other as this forum is a great place for all of us newbies as well as professionals. I have had a new machine in my kitchen for almost 3 months. We have become very intimate Without support, you have to learn from scratch. I have some contacts that could help you. Very helpful and knowledgeable.

http://www.seagamfg.com

http://www.seagamfg.com/saeco_coffee_vending_machines.html

http://www.shopsaeco.com/

[Greatdane]

Just got my new http://www.vendingtimes.com/me2/default.asp magazine. just learned about Saega and Saeco on a new venture.

Seaga Partners With Fresh Healthy Vending To Market Coffee Machine

http://www.vendingtimes.com/ME2/dirmod.asp?sid=&nm=Article+Archives&type=Publishing&mod=Publications%3A%3AArticle&mid=8F3A7027421841978F18BE895F87F791&tier=4&id=0B8F903D8C0B4765B6C5F3D6529894D0

This machine sounds awesome. If I were to spend thousands on a coffee vendor, this would be my choice. But, unfortunately as luck would have it, It seems that you might have to go through one of those business-opportunity company's to get one according to the article above.

[mission vending]

I happen to be at the right place performing a HVAC start-up on a roof top unit at the VA clinic in the mall. After I was done, I stopped at the mall managers office and told her about my new gourmet coffee business. She wants two gourmet coffee machines placed in the center of the mall for their customers just like that. Was the easiest placement locating yet.

The mall has no food and only beverages is a couple Pepsi/coke machines. The coolest part is that there is no commission I have to pay. The manager is just happy to have anything that would allow customers to stay a little longer in the mall.

Once Walmart entered town, 1/2 the mall emptied. She even gave me a guarantee of 20 cups a day for each machine. Doing a little averaging math and that adds up to around $280 a week minus cost of around .285 cents a cup equals around $200 profit a week. Not to bad for 4 hours maintenance a week including travel. Two visits a week. Going to place them Monday. I wish Saeco would make a 70 mm 4 once cup for giving samples out.

Glad to see that you are getting a couple more of your Seaco SG200 Barista Supremo System by canmax out on location and making money for you.

[caserri]

Just got my new http://www.vendingtimes.com/me2/default.asp magazine. just learned about Saega and Saeco on a new venture.

Seaga Partners With Fresh Healthy Vending To Market Coffee Machine

http://www.vendingtimes.com/ME2/dirmod.asp?sid=&nm=Article+Archives&type=Publishing&mod=Publications%3A%3AArticle&mid=8F3A7027421841978F18BE895F87F791&tier=4&id=0B8F903D8C0B4765B6C5F3D6529894D0

This machine sounds awesome. If I were to spend thousands on a coffee vendor, this would be my choice. But, unfortunately as luck would have it, It seems that you might have to go through one of those business-opportunity company's to get one according to the article above.

Eddie,

I'm disappointed in you. That story was posted here on the forum a month ago.

Here is the link...

http://www.vendiscuss.net/index.php?/topic/12016-seaga-partners-with-fresh-healthy-vending-to-market-coffee-machine/

Sent using Tapatalk 2

[Greatdane]

Eddie,

I'm disappointed in you. That story was posted here on the forum a month ago.

Here is the link...

http://www.vendiscuss.net/index.php?/topic/12016-seaga-partners-with-fresh-healthy-vending-to-market-coffee-machine/

Sent using Tapatalk 2

You are so right. I did read it in the blog first but I am behind times and read it in the hard copy again. I knew I read it somewhere as through the blog I learned about Saega. I can be Ssslow at times

What would you guess a retail price for the Dimante machine would be. I wonder if $5,495.00 would be in the ball park? That is around "in my opinion" what a retail, Italian made, Saeco 200 gourmet coffee machine goes for.

PS, thanks so much for the link for the free subscription to Vending Times. A little extra perk for all of us forum members. keep up the great work!

All others that have not taken up this benefit, please click on this link: http://vendiscuss.net/index.php?/files/download/36-free-12-month-subscription-to-vt/ for your copy. A warm thanks to Vending Times for this benefit.

Peace through Vending,

Greatdane

[Greatdane]

Just a little update on how everything is going. I am very pleased with my decision to purchase these Saeco gourmet coffee machines.

I have two machines placed and they do require maintenance at least twice a week to ensure everything is working perfectly. I also found that by placing my cell number on the machine/photo frame, people will text me if there is a issue. Would be a pain having the machine break down for a few days until you come and maintain it. My costs are averaging about .29 cents a cup (on the hi-end, I'm using really good beans) without having to pay a commission. Numbers are coming in around about $759 gross monthly with $250 product consumable cost which leaves about about $500 x 2 machines a month = about $1000.00 take home. Not bad for servicing the machines twice a week at about 4 hours total a week time devoted. I really do a really nice job of cleaning as this is a food product and the machines work very well when maintained.

I have been tweaking the recipes to satisfy customer requests. like a little more cappuccino cream on top of the french vanilla. So far everyone is real satisfied. I sure wish there was a recipe book out there from Saeco so as to try different tried and true customer approved coffee beverages. Any operators out there have anything like that? Programming is pretty straight forward. Example is C (coffee) 180 water, 140 product #1, 60 product #2 and 20 product #3. There are 3 dry product bins, 1 sugar and 1 coffee. I am thinking of trying a caramel type french vanilla next.

Peace

Greatdane

[chilly]

I've purchased two of these machines from a guy who claimed to buy them from Canmax but wasn't an part of teh overall program and didnt have access to the Barista Forum. Anyhow..the machines had less than 600 cup count on them and i paid $2,200 each. One is great, one im struggling with, i seem to get a lot of cup jams or cups not dropping. Same cups, all from canmax.

The other issue, is the stir sticks supplied don't seem to drop, when i called canmax they said to grind the door where teh sticks drop as north american sticks are thicker than European ones. Anyone else having this issue? Also im having trouble locating more stir stick, that fit, i would have thought it that it would be easy. Where is everyone else buying from?

Thx

[Greatdane]

I bought my machines from "Approved Operator's" but I learned that even know you bought the machines and/or business, you will find that you can't get access to the forums. It appears to me that it seems to be Canmax's business model. Maybe you could get lucky and the previous owner will give you their sign in information.

So far I haven't had any issues as to cup jams. As for the cups I use, I find they have to be 70mm 8.25 ounce type. I received a couple cases with my machines. The plain Saeco cups with Saeco written on them seem to be cheaply made and thin. The other case is made by International cup and part number Gourmet caffe HV08280 and come in a 2000 count case. I have not had one jam yet. The cups appear to be loosely packed and make sure they kinda spin out. Observe the machine that works and then go back to your problem machine and see if there is a difference in vending.

I received my machines with a case of 10,000 sticks and the case says made in China. I couldn't believe with all our trees, we can't get made in USA sticks. I wrapped the case many times with plastic wrapping tape to help keep them from warping. I too had to take a flat file and file down the corners so regular size stir sticks would vend right. One trick is to NEVER let them be stored in a hi humidity area, they will warp and will not dispense properly. They must be straight and make sure you are using the little round weight to help them vend properly. My stir sticks are the same exact type that are in popsicle's. Try googling popsicle stick vendors. An example = http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/603164673/Popsicle_Sticks . Watch while they are vended and note at what point they are sticking.

You have made a nice choice in machines. hope this helps. feel free to ask any questions and I will try to get you a answer if I can.

[rinna40]

I am so glad that I found this website! My husband and I also first saw the Saeco SG200 at a trade show, and went to three separate meetings with Canmax. I too was astounded at how little information you could find out about the company on the net. I also found it funny how thier site always leads back to Philips, but the people at these meetings would not clarify who actually owned what. It made me quite uneasy about signing up with them, but I liked the idea of the machines and I loved the coffee. My husband and I decided that we would buy a couple of used machines and make a go of it on our own. We have five machines now, and have placed three of them. We have been told by two of our clients that the coffee is too strong. I was hoping that someone on this thread would be willing to share their recipe for a mild coffee. We are using Starbucks Signature Coffee, that we buy at Costco. Any help would be really appreciated.

[Greatdane]

Glad you are on board and welcome to the forum.

You made a great decision going your own way and buying second hand. I too went to a biz op show in Minneapolis and was very impressed by the profit potential of these Saeco SG200 machines. When I did research about the offering biz op company, I hit a brick wall and information was extremely vague and hard to find. It seemed that there was a act now before the opportunity disappears kind of rush feel to the opportunity. As you read in my previous posts, bad weather saved me tens of thousands of dollars.There seems to be more information available overseas in Australia than what I found available here in the US. It is like a worm is running through the internet eliminating useful information or people are very secretive and keeping the useful info to themselves. Now when people Google "Saeco SG200" you get a link to this awesome forum. before my posts, it was pretty silent on search results. How did you happen to find this forum?

Being the official "approved Operator" forum seems to be closed tight to non-approved operators I have started this thread so we can all learn the tips and tricks ourselves and learn from each other. Feel free to post any questions, comments or advice you may have here so that this thread stays active for others like you, your husband and others like us.

In my personal opinion, I could not see paying around and upwards of $4,100.00 - $5,495 a machine and around 10k for the start-up. It seems you now have 5 machines and if you had paid retail, you would have spent about $37,470.00-$40,000 worth of machines and start up not inclusive of discounts or the cost of DBA's that may be in each machine. You would have to sell around 50 thousand cups of coffee to recoup your potential investment as a approved operator. (guesstimate average-not to be taken as hard fact for those that are keeping track) I have placed a search word notification in E bay for Saeco SG200. Anytime someone lists one, the price averages about $1,000 - $2,200 each plus shipping. The price between retail and what it seems like you get aftermarket is worse than depreciation of a new car. You seem to lose about 75% to 80% in only a year or two. I have purchased brand new, never taken out of the box, decked out with a new DBA (dollar bill acceptor) and coin-co changer's for $1,000 each. In my opinion, somebody took quite the shellacking on their retail purchase. I am very pleased you too found a way to take advantage of the profit potential without the very high cost of start-up overhead. So much easier making a profit from a start-up cost of around $10-15k than to have to wait till you sell 50k worth of great coffee.

You made a great decision to purchase the Saeco SG200's on your own. I have also found that Seaga tech support is super duper. From those that have contacted me, (and that is a understatement) they say they really know their stuff. I have yet to have a single malfunction with the machines (knock on wood) It is really nice to open the machine and pull a huge stack of 1's and 5's out of the dba and finding a nice turnover of product so inventory stays very fresh and very happy coffee drinkers and no errors. I keep my machines very clean and sterile as coffee along with the other items are a food product like cappuccino cream powder topping.

As to address your previous question, I can try to help you with what I have learned.

Depending on the strength of your coffee beans, you may want to reduce your coffee dosage. If you do not have the machine manual, I have enclosed a link to my past post of a pdf version of the manual in this forum topic thread.

http://vendiscuss.ne...&attach_id=1963

If you refer to page 51, you will find instructions on adjusting the dosage of coffee. Also, I find you must always check the bean expiration. If the beans are old or expired, they will get a kind of bitterness that can be confused with too much coffee. I have found a great supplier via Amazon for great coffee beans roasted perfectly for the default dosage. Not too strong and not to weak. http://www.amazon.co...ils_o00_s00_i00 I signed up for their subscribe and save plan and the price drops to about .39 cents a ounce $14.19 for three pounds. Shipping is included with subscribe and save. I have my machines set at about 7 grams per cup. I get about 4 cups to the ounce of coffee which equals about .10 cents cost for each 8.25 ounce cup of coffee. One ounce = 28.35 grams at 7 grams a cup.

I have received great feedback from the coffee drinkers and eight o'clock brand appears to be a hit. Grinds awesome and tastes great like a fresh gourmet cup of coffee should. My customers love it and at around 30+ cups a day cup sales are proof that I have happy customers.

Greatdane

[rinna40]

Thank you so much for your advice. I dialed the machine down to a 5 and the coffe tastes much smoother. Hopefully my clients like it too.

To answer your question, I found this thread by Googling "Seaco SG200 Recipe", and it this thread was at the bottom of the first page. So glad that it is here, as it always helps to be able to dialogue with people in the same business. Excited to hear that you sell 30+ cups a day. At present our machines are only doing about 15 cups a day, but I hope it improves. We live in a small town, so it is harder to find locations that have enough people. Also, we compete with Tim Horton's, which some people seem to feel a religious afiliation to. In our town of 16 000 people, there are four Tim Horton's restaurants, and many people seem to going to the drive thru as having a break. It is hard to change people's habits.... We do see the numbers coming up slightly though, and have yet to go through a winter, when we hope sales will increase.

Thanks again

Rinna

[Greatdane]

Nothing beats a nice frothy cream topped hot chocolate or French Vanilla on those cold days. I use the #1 key as a shift key and use all 15 drink selections. For a quarter more the machine gives you a double espresso and/or lots of frothy extra whipped extra cream. When the hot chocolate or any other drink comes out looking fluffy whipped, people keep coming back. I use Swans- cappuccino topping that came from the previous business owners I bought them from. I still have to do some research on a new supplier as when I Google Swans, It doesn't really hit a distributor.

I like Swans brand because it doesn't cake in the container like cement and has that very sweet creamy taste like real cream. Whips up awesome in the whipper. Also, some cool advice is to use "hot chocolate designed for whippers" It will have a name like Nestle Whipper Mix. I can get that and French Vanilla whipper mix from my local supplier but seem to have a hard time as yet getting a cappuccino topping supplier. People do use powdered milk, but I like the sweetness and preservative anti-caking of the cappuccino topping. Really makes the creamy drinks special. If your going to have gourmet coffee, you must have awesome cream to go with it. What type of powder cream do you use?

Greatdane

[rinna40]

I use Vim Freeze Dried milk. I have had some problem with it caking over the weekends. I'll try to find the swan brand. I'm in Ontario, so I'm not sure if I can get the same things as you. I'll need to do a little playing around, to get more options on my machines. Right now, I only have one choice per button. What are you referring to when you talk about cappuccino toppings? Do you mean chocolate and cinnamon powder? I'm looking to get some of those too. I was also thinking of supplying flavour shots, but wasn't sure how to go about charging for it.

Rinna

[Joven76]

I'm hoping someone has had this issue before. I turned off the machine to service it, when I turned it back on it cycled on completely. I tried to brew a cup and it stopped just before it ground the beans, giving me an error message of #05. It's not the first time I got this error message, and I usually reset the machine, go into the maintenance menu, clear the error and let the machine reset again. However this time, I can't even get into the maintenance menu now. I noticed the brew assembly didn't cycle during the reset, so I checked it and I can't remove it. I can turn the release knob completely, but it still won't budge, and I can't seem to get it to unjam.

Has anyone had this issue before and if so, how do you fix it.

HELP!!!

[Greatdane]

I'm hoping someone has had this issue before. I turned off the machine to service it, when I turned it back on it cycled on completely. I tried to brew a cup and it stopped just before it ground the beans, giving me an error message of #05.

HELP!!!

Sounds like you have turbine impulses not read error (flow meter). I would make sure that water is being pumped and is circulating throughout the system. This is accomplished by pressing pressing P2 (maintenance button) then P1 (Programming button) at the same time. This will pump water to fill the system. Air can be trapped and this will purge the system of air. Water will go through the flow meter, boiler and then come out as hot water. There must be water in the boiler to heat or operation stops.

Make sure there is no loose wire connections leading to the flow meter, pump and thermal protector. The flow meter is the little white device in front of the water pump with three wires going to it (brown, red and white wires) If debris gets in it, it may plug up. There is a micro spinning paddle inside the flow meter that rotates and that is how water is sensed. If error #5 does not reset and If by chance you have another machine available, you can swap the flow meter from another machine to verify it is not bad. If your pump is starting to fail, this error # 5 may also appear.

You may want to check the water pump that is located behind back panel lower left. It has a hard plastic line leading to the boiler. As this pump runs the DL12 LED flash's indicating that it is operating and is sensed by the flow meter. Also, there is a thermal protector (120 ^c) on the pump (red wire) It is there to protect the pump and if this circuit is not complete or water is not sensed by the flow meter, it will also cause a error #5 and may appear right before the beans are about to grind as water is pumped.

If you check your main board in the back you should see a row of LED's. DL12 blinks when water is pumped and is sensed by the flow meter. DL12 is located behind the rear access panel on the main board lower right corner and it is the LED that is the second farthest left in the row of LED's. DL13 is the first LED counting left to right. DL13 is the boiler start "heating" LED that is lit during start-up and while boiler is heating. DL12 is the impulse counter indicator LED that blinks as the water pump runs and the flow meter is sensing water.

Make sure there are no debris jamming the grinder. If the open/close door in the coffee bean container is not closed before removing, beans may spill in places they should not go causing jams. I have heard of debris like a very small rock that can jam the grinder and cause intermittent problems. Also, you may, once you remove the brew group, carefully clean the screens and verify there are no jams and or debris blocking water flow.

Hope this helps,

Greatdane

[Greatdane]

I use Vim Freeze Dried milk. I have had some problem with it caking over the weekends. I'll try to find the swan brand. I'm in Ontario, so I'm not sure if I can get the same things as you. I'll need to do a little playing around, to get more options on my machines. Right now, I only have one choice per button. What are you referring to when you talk about cappuccino toppings? Do you mean chocolate and cinnamon powder? I'm looking to get some of those too. I was also thinking of supplying flavour shots, but wasn't sure how to go about charging for it.

Rinna

The cappuccino topping is like powdered milk but whips up really nice and has a nice sweet flavor and adds a very nice presentation to the gourmet coffee.

I have yet to have it cake up or malfunction during delivery.

I scanned a package so you can get the information off it

[Joven76]

Sounds like you have turbine impulses not read error (flow meter). I would make sure that water is being pumped and is circulating throughout the system. This is accomplished by pressing pressing P2 (maintenance button) then P1 (Programming button) at the same time. This will pump water to fill the system. Air can be trapped and this will purge the system of air. Water will go through the flow meter, boiler and then come out as hot water. There must be water in the boiler to heat or operation stops.

Make sure there is no loose wire connections leading to the flow meter, pump and thermal protector. The flow meter is the little white device in front of the water pump with three wires going to it (brown, red and white wires) If debris gets in it, it may plug up. There is a micro spinning paddle inside the flow meter that rotates and that is how water is sensed. If error #5 does not reset and If by chance you have another machine available, you can swap the flow meter from another machine to verify it is not bad. If your pump is starting to fail, this error # 5 may also appear.

You may want to check the water pump that is located behind back panel lower left. It has a hard plastic line leading to the boiler. As this pump runs the DL12 LED flash's indicating that it is operating and is sensed by the flow meter. Also, there is a thermal protector (120 ^c) on the pump (red wire) It is there to protect the pump and if this circuit is not complete or water is not sensed by the flow meter, it will also cause a error #5 and may appear right before the beans are about to grind as water is pumped.

If you check your main board in the back you should see a row of LED's. DL12 blinks when water is pumped and is sensed by the flow meter. DL12 is located behind the rear access panel on the main board lower right corner and it is the LED that is the second farthest left in the row of LED's. DL13 is the first LED counting left to right. DL13 is the boiler start "heating" LED that is lit during start-up and while boiler is heating. DL12 is the impulse counter indicator LED that blinks as the water pump runs and the flow meter is sensing water.

Make sure there are no debris jamming the grinder. If the open/close door in the coffee bean container is not closed before removing, beans may spill in places they should not go causing jams. I have heard of debris like a very small rock that can jam the grinder and cause intermittent problems. Also, you may, once you remove the brew group, carefully clean the screens and verify there are no jams and or debris blocking water flow.

Hope this helps,

Greatdane

Thanks for the reply Greatdane, I will take a look at some of the things you suggested, if I have any errors, I'll let you know. But I do have one question, because when I turn the machine on I can't even log into any of the menus, do you think I'll still be able to successfully purge the system of air?

[Greatdane]

Thanks for the reply Greatdane, I will take a look at some of the things you suggested, if I have any errors, I'll let you know. But I do have one question, because when I turn the machine on I can't even log into any of the menus, do you think I'll still be able to successfully purge the system of air?

If you can reset the error, you should be able to bleed the system of air. Just in case, here is the manual that shows you how to reset the machine and any other information you might need.

Saeco 200 Manual.pdf

[Joven76]

If you can reset the error, you should be able to bleed the system of air. Just in case, here is the manual that shows you how to reset the machine and any other information you might need.

See, there's my problem, I cannot reset the machine... When I power it back on it immediately goes to the error message and won't let me get into any of the menus...

[Greatdane]

See, there's my problem, I cannot reset the machine... When I power it back on it immediately goes to the error message and won't let me get into any of the menus...

You should be able to reset outside of the menu's. Once the machine is on and you see the error, you should be able to hold P1 and P2 at the same time until you here beeping. About 5-10 seconds. You then can use the front buttons that you use to program the machine. Left, right, cancel and the enter key. It will show you the error list and by pressing enter, it will attempt to remove the error. If at the end of this procedure, at least one error condition remains unchanged, the display will show the message "Fail X/N" where X is the number of errors and N is the total numbers of errors detected. The machine should sound a few beeps and you should be able to reset by pressing enter.

[Joven76]

You should be able to reset outside of the menu's. Once the machine is on and you see the error, you should be able to hold P1 and P2 at the same time until you here beeping. About 5-10 seconds. You then can use the front buttons that you use to program the machine. Left, right, cancel and the enter key. It will show you the error list and by pressing enter, it will attempt to remove the error. If at the end of this procedure, at least one error condition remains unchanged, the display will show the message "Fail X/N" where X is the number of errors and N is the total numbers of errors detected. The machine should sound a few beeps and you should be able to reset by pressing enter.

Thanks again Greatdane, I'll take a look at this when I get home on another machine i have with the same problem and let you know if I have any other issues.

[Joven76]

Well, that didin't work. I pressed the P1 and P2 at the same time and held it for at least 30 seconds and nothing happened. Any other suggestions?