Crane 181 Only Outputting 12 Unique MDB Codes

[DeeBee]

Hi All, 

I'm looking for some help with this issue.  I have a Crane 181 with a Nayax VPOS Touch card reader that I recently put in service.  The machine is working well, but it's only outputting 12 unique MDB codes when I vend each item to get the map for my Nayax inventory.  Looks like 5 of the 6 items on each tray share an MDB code.  There was another post about this but I didn't see a clear resolution.  I'm hoping someone has the answer on how to fix this as I can't see individual products or inventory levels through the Nayax app.  

My questions are:

• Is there a way to program MDB codes to product selections through the onboard menu within the machine?  I haven't been able to find it as of yet.
• Is this caused by the machine or the Nayax reader?  I have a ticket open with Nayax as well just in case they have seen this before and have an answer
• Has anyone experienced this before with a 181 or any machine and what did you do?

Thanks!

[AZVendor]

That's a pretty old machine and DEX has been cannibalized by the manufacturer for other software things they want machines to do.  You are probably limited to whatever output you get.

[AngryChris]

16 hours ago, AZVendor said:

That's a pretty old machine and DEX has been cannibalized by the manufacturer for other software things they want machines to do.  You are probably limited to whatever output you get.

I think you're confusing the model numbers.  The 181 is a merchant with optional touch screen.

[AZVendor]

I was thinking it was a GPL.

[AngryChris]

On 9/19/2023 at 3:01 PM, DeeBee said:

Hi All, 

I'm looking for some help with this issue.  I have a Crane 181 with a Nayax VPOS Touch card reader that I recently put in service.  The machine is working well, but it's only outputting 12 unique MDB codes when I vend each item to get the map for my Nayax inventory.  Looks like 5 of the 6 items on each tray share an MDB code.  There was another post about this but I didn't see a clear resolution.  I'm hoping someone has the answer on how to fix this as I can't see individual products or inventory levels through the Nayax app.  

My questions are:

• Is there a way to program MDB codes to product selections through the onboard menu within the machine?  I haven't been able to find it as of yet.
• Is this caused by the machine or the Nayax reader?  I have a ticket open with Nayax as well just in case they have seen this before and have an answer
• Has anyone experienced this before with a 181 or any machine and what did you do?

Thanks!

I'm confused about the codes.  I don't have a 181 or nayax but machines do put codes out.  However, those codes should be unique to the selections.  So maybe A1 or 10 is a code 0000 whereas the next code is 0001 or whatever.

For cantaloupe readers, I have to use column maps to change those codes to something that makes sense like 0000 becomes A1.  Then, in my vms, I have today what's in A1.  It really depends on what you're trying to do.

[DeeBee]

It is very strange as I figured each selection must have a unique MDB identifier, but this doesn't...or at least it isn't outputting properly.  Here's what I got after I vended all 42 items in the machine: 

MDB Codes:

12592

12593

12848

12849

13104

13105

13360

13361

13616

13617

13872

13873

Good news is the machine is very busy.  Bad news is I have no clue what's selling until I visit.  My other machines all output unique codes per selection as you stated (i.e. Product selection A1 = MDB code 153; A3 = MDB code 155, etc.).  This seems to be a great machine and is the right size for this location, so I would hate to swap it out for something else.  It's a six tray machine and it's giving me twelve unique identifiers, so I feel like it's something that can be fixed.  Each item selection works when it's used, so maybe something with the board communicating back to the motors?  If I get really desperate, I can just make each item a unique price so I can track it that way😆 

 

Edited September 21 by DeeBee
Typo

[AngryChris]

I see.  As you and I suspect, 42 different motors should give 42 unique codes but do not.  My best guess would be that the eprom needs updated.  A machine that new should be good to go but crane is crane so... 

What kind of vms do you use?  Do you use column mapping?

[DeeBee]

I use the Nayax VMS (MoMa 2.0). There is column mapping built in but it’s not always accurate…and not sure it would work in this scenario.
Nayax is slow to respond to help tickets but I do have one open with them for possible guidance. 
I think you might be right about an eprom update to get this issue resolved. I’m going to look into that and ask around a bit more. 
Also hoping someone else that had this issue, and resolved it, comes across our conversation and shares their experience. 
Thanks for the thoughts so far. 

[AngryChris]

I have national 157s, some LCMs, 501es, etc.. all capable of logic or mdb because it was a transitional time between communication protocols.  At worst, they wouldn't accept cards at all or just wouldn't report cash sales, but all of them would give unique codes for every selection and those models are all 20+ years old as far as I know, and all work perfectly with late version software on the eproms except LCMs (they never report cash sales).  

I ask about the vms because I'm wondering if it's causing this too.  To date, with cantaloupe, I haven't ever seemed to get anything different by having the ded cable plugged in but maybe it does.  I haven't cared to look into that.  But do you have a dex cable plugged in too?  Obviously the issue should be either the board or nayax.  It is truly odd.

[DeeBee]

I do have DEX plugged in and I was actually thinking about unplugging to see if I get a different result.  I haven’t exported the existing DEX data to Excel to see if I can get anything worthwhile out of it, but will try that too.
On Nayax, it doesn’t report DEX data in real-time unless you tell it to…and even then I think there’s a delay.  Right now, I have it do a DEX read at 12 am each night. I don’t get much benefit other than cash count…and that doesn’t always work properly. 

I’m still wondering how it’s vending properly without unique values but maybe it’s able to pass the item selection number to the board and then to the corresponding motor. 

[AZVendor]

It vends properly because that is a function of the logic board running it's normal routines regardless of what card reader is has or if it reports over DEX protocol.  The DEX is an extraction from the logic board that is separate from the actual process of vending.