Is being cheap smart or stupid?

[bill123]

It seems this thread has lost focus. The topic is CoGS and whether one should strive to lower costs by putting in product of less value or maintain higher value product at a higher CoGS.

1. I beleive you have more theft if your customers feel they are being ripped off. If you rip them off they will rip you off.

2. You will have more sales if you have a value product.

3. If there is little perceived value you will loose the account

4. The average markup in retail has always been 100%. Therefor a at $1.00 you need to have an average price of your product of 50 cents. Less than that causes 1 & 2 & 3 above.

If you disagree please, explain why the points I made are wrong. I would love explanitory responses to each point or even one or two. Also, does anyone agree with any of my points?

[sherlock]

The topic is CoGS and whether one should strive to lower costs by putting in product of less value or maintain higher value product at a higher CoGS.

1. I beleive you have more theft if your customers feel they are being ripped off. If you rip them off they will rip you off.

2. You will have more sales if you have a value product.

3. If there is little perceived value you will loose the account

4. The average markup in retail has always been 100%. Therefor a at $1.00 you need to have an average price of your product of 50 cents. Less than that causes 1 & 2 & 3 above.

Don't know where you got that "markup in retail has always been 100%", but you are wrong about that.

If it was so at one time. It is no longer so today.

If you don't believe that, just look at it this way:

Do those $50 Levi's at JCPenney cost JCP $25? No.

Does it cost McDonalds $.50 to get you those $1 fries? No.

Do those $120 Nike Basketball shoes cost Foot Locker $60? No.

Is Walmart paying $20 for that $40 coffee maker? No.

Does that Coke in the vending machine for $1.50 cost the vendor $.75? No.

I could go on and on, but I won't.

The point is, there are plenty of times where markup is WAY BEYOND 100% in today's market-place.

It seems to me you don't understand the rules of supply and demand, the buying power of bulk purchasing, and the rules of contract pricing.

So it's not surprising that you do not understand COG management.

And though you may argue that you do know proper COG management, your points 1, 2, 3, and 4 above indicate otherwise.

Remember: You came here asking for help.

The proper way to do that is by being respectful.

Belittling anyone's lack of experience WHO MAY BE WILLING TO HELP YOU is not the right way of going about getting help.

Suppose I stopped to help you change a roadside flat tire on a rainy night and you suggested you would only accept my help if I was a licensed mechanic.

How would you expect me to react?

C'mon bill, read the replies on this thread.

Then read the replies/help given to other folks new to the industry who come on this forum with the proper attitude.

See a difference? Why do you suppose you are not being given the same level of guidance?

Here's a hint: It's your attitude.

You may not have meant to come across as the south-end of a north-bound donkey, but you have.

So hit "reset" on your attitude and be willing to graciously accept advice/help from everyone willing to give it.

Doing so will only benefit YOU.

Remember, you are the one looking for guidance.

[newheart53]

You say its our atitudes thats wrong , but if you will read what everyone is saying you might get a clue as to where this went wrong. No, the post might have started out about COGs, but once you included that snyde remark it opened it for all the rest.

Sherlock and dogcow Has responded with some very good info and you still don't want to accept it. Do you Think you might ought to start a new post with a heading of I'M SORRY FOR MY RUDE BEHAVIOR, and really mean it, then we that have vast amounts of sales experience might want to help you.

When you sold a house in Cali that you knew was only worth 300,000 but you had a suc buyer you knew would pay 500,000 did you tell the buyer and the seller that the house was only worth 300 so you could only sell it for 300. I don't think so! So you really don't understand supply and demand.

[dogcow]

Could you enlighten me as to what parts of my approach are way off base to the point of being comical

yes everything, ur cogs, ur locating approach, its all screwy...just read this forum, READ THE OLD POSTINGS. its not complicated business. and another member on here who h as now left, i spent many HOURS both e-mail and on the phone explaining how to get his business going and make money in honor boxes..u know why? because he was a nice guy and very respectful and earnest

[dogcow]

It seems this thread has lost focus. The topic is CoGS and whether one should strive to lower costs by putting in product of less value or maintain higher value product at a higher CoGS.

1. I beleive you have more theft if your customers feel they are being ripped off. If you rip them off they will rip you off.

2. You will have more sales if you have a value product.

3. If there is little perceived value you will loose the account

4. The average markup in retail has always been 100%. Therefor a at $1.00 you need to have an average price of your product of 50 cents. Less than that causes 1 & 2 & 3 above.

If you disagree please, explain why the points I made are wrong. I would love explanitory responses to each point or even one or two. Also, does anyone agree with any of my points?

people dont steal because they think the price is a rip off , if that was true every convenience store on earth

would be robbed blind. thieves are scum bags and they are gonna steal it doesnt matter if its a good deal

or a bad deal u know why ...CAUSE THEY ARENT PAYING FOR IT EITHER WAY.

to keep down theft its simple...

1-prices in even dollar amounts

2-have a good relationship with the account

just look at my thread honor box doubters...i have several accts like that where if i was a few days late

they would call me to make sure i was ok or if the box was empty they'd put it up in the closet away from

the customers/employees. If it was short and i left a note the next week it would be over paid. this was because

i was nice, and friendly and made sure my clients felt like i was a real person so they didnt want to cheat me.

[bill123]

You say its our atitudes thats wrong , but if you will read what everyone is saying you might get a clue as to where this went wrong. No, the post might have started out about COGs, but once you included that snyde remark it opened it for all the rest.

Sherlock and dogcow Has responded with some very good info and you still don't want to accept it. Do you Think you might ought to start a new post with a heading of I'M SORRY FOR MY RUDE BEHAVIOR, and really mean it, then we that have vast amounts of sales experience might want to help you.

When you sold a house in Cali that you knew was only worth 300,000 but you had a suc buyer you knew would pay 500,000 did you tell the buyer and the seller that the house was only worth 300 so you could only sell it for 300. I don't think so! So you really don't understand supply and demand.

Yes if I had a buyer and I thought the house was worth $300,000 I would absolutely tell the buyer and the seller it was worth $300,000. It's called ethics. And it is because I had ethics I sold 120 homes a year and had 23 agents working for me. I can not imagine being a scum bag and betraying my fiduciary relationship with a buyer just for more commission. That would be no way to build a business.

[bill123]

people dont steal because they think the price is a rip off , if that was true every convenience store on earth

would be robbed blind. thieves are scum bags and they are gonna steal it doesnt matter if its a good deal

or a bad deal u know why ...CAUSE THEY ARENT PAYING FOR IT EITHER WAY.

to keep down theft its simple...

1-prices in even dollar amounts

2-have a good relationship with the account

just look at my thread honor box doubters...i have several accts like that where if i was a few days late

they would call me to make sure i was ok or if the box was empty they'd put it up in the closet away from

the customers/employees. If it was short and i left a note the next week it would be over paid. this was because

i was nice, and friendly and made sure my clients felt like i was a real person so they didnt want to cheat me.

I think you make a good point people who steal outright will steal anyway. I agree 110%. But (if I'm allowed to have my own opinion) I do think some people will pay but pay what they think it is worth if it is a rip off. For example , They see Austin Crackers which they personally byuy all the time at Costco and only through in 50 cents instead of a dollar. So, you changed by thoughts somewhat on point 1, on point 2 & 3 you have not said anything that changes my thinking, but I am open to learn.

Sherlock, As far as mark-up you are right on convienient stores and restaurants. You are wrong on Nike & Walmart. I've worked in retail and my 100% mark up is spot on for most (not all)stores. There are definately business models like Costco and Sams that are different as well as others. Point 4 you are correct in specific instances, but as a whole what I said is true.

[bill123]

Remember: You came here asking for help.

The proper way to do that is by being respectful.

Belittling anyone's lack of experience WHO MAY BE WILLING TO HELP YOU is not the right way of going about getting help.

Suppose I stopped to help you change a roadside flat tire on a rainy night and you suggested you would only accept my help if I was a licensed mechanic.

How would you expect me to react?

C'mon bill, read the replies on this thread.

Then read the replies/help given to other folks new to the industry who come on this forum with the proper attitude.

See a difference? Why do you suppose you are not being given the same level of guidance?

Here's a hint: It's your attitude.

You may not have meant to come across as the south-end of a north-bound donkey, but you have.

So hit "reset" on your attitude and be willing to graciously accept advice/help from everyone willing to give it.

Doing so will only benefit YOU.

Remember, you are the one looking for guidance.

You didn't say what was wrong with points 2 & 3 so should I assume you believe they have some validity?

I will try to be more aware of peoples sensitivites. (Probably hate how I said that. ;-) I didn't realize I was insulting anyone personally and that there would be people who assumed I was talking specifically about them personally.

I want advice from people who are successful and I can't be sorry about that. Everyones opinion is not equal. For example if someone asked me about being successful in real estate I would not send them to talk to everyone because if they did they what an average person does they would not do well. In any business if someone wants to succede they should seek out the advice of the best. And I'm assuming since you are the moderator you must be one of the best. So when you see me write something about not wanting advice from people doing less than average I am not talking about you. (But that point is mute now because I am going to take your advise and not do it, but at the same time when I am personally attacked I will respond if I feel like it. Trust me I know I should respond, but like most people I can't help it.

I came to this forum to learn and to help people if I end up being successful. I am going to try very hard to project a "good attitude" but could you do me a favor and take note that there are some people on this forum that go out of there way to do personal attacks and once they start they don't stop. My broad "attack" on no one in particular will not happen again, but on th other hand directed personal; attacks need to be noticed also. My bet is that a lot of new people come to this forum and when they start to get pummled by the guys who think they are the big dogs on the playground they stop posting because it's not worth it.

Shelock when I said you were wrong on Nike I do not include there upper end product, that definately is one of the exceptions. The average shoe definately is 100% markup. That I know for a fact because I managed a shoe store before. Very successfully I might add.

[dogcow]

Yes if I had a buyer and I thought the house was worth $300,000 I would absolutely tell the buyer and the seller it was worth $300,000. It's called ethics.

no its its called an appraisal LOL

i already explained why ur wrong in ur other thread, u just want someone to tell u what a genius u are but

no,sorry, there is no logic in putting in all high cost goods . in fact i pointed out to every account WHY i used some

cheaper items to cover stealing , every single person understood, the average person is actually pretty smart

much more than u would give them credit for LOL

go back to that example and plug in 20% for cogs and not 50% and see what u get

some people just steal, they steal cause they think they wont get caught, or they think its no big

deal cause its just a bag of chips, or u are a big company so who cares about you

or because they just dont have a dollar that day and it happens to be the day you collect

sometimes because they are just crooks and get off on it, or they dont care

[bill123]

no its its called an appraisal LOL

i already explained why ur wrong in ur other thread, u just want someone to tell u what a genius u are but

no,sorry, there is no logic in putting in all high cost goods . in fact i pointed out to every account WHY i used some

cheaper items to cover stealing , every single person understood, the average person is actually pretty smart

much more than u would give them credit for LOL

some people just steal, they steal cause they think they wont get caught, or they think its no big

deal cause its just a bag of chips, or u are a big company so who cares about you

or because they just dont have a dollar that day and it happens to be the day you collect

sometimes because they are just crooks and get off on it, or they dont care

You are a maniac. I agreed with you on your point about stealing and still you found a way to go off. Nuts!

As far as the appraisal comments I have no idea what you mean. I said one has an ethical responsibility to the buyer they are working for to tell them they would be over paying. That has nothing to do with appraisal. REALLY nuts!

I should mention I do carry some cheaper items. I do not TRY to keep the costs high. I stock the box based on industry reports like SNAXPO and the SymphonyIRI Group and the Food Institutes "Food Industry Review". My entire philosephy was to match my supply as close to demand as possible. So, if it called for some cheaper item that is what I bought.

[dogcow]

i dont think it was clear ur a buyers agent

go plug in 20% to the calculations, leave the rest of the percentages the same, then let me know if it still doesnt make sense that ur cogs are way whacked out. u clearly dont understand that even if it lowers ur theft its not worth it because theft is a function of goods cost...thats pretty obvious im not sure why u cant figure that out

[bill123]

i dont think it was clear ur a buyers agent

go plug in 20% to the calculations, leave the rest of the percentages the same, then let me know if it still doesnt make sense that ur cogs are way whacked out. u clearly dont understand that even if it lowers ur theft its not worth it because theft is a function of goods cost...thats pretty obvious im not sure why u cant figure that out

I think it will lower theft a little maybe 5%, that is not the brunt of my arguement. I beleive the difference will be made up in in volume and in maintaining accounts. Points 2 & 3, (you know the ones you are ignoring). Yes, if you assume no increase in volume lower CoGS is better, obviously. You are no genius for saying lower CoGS is better given the same volume. But sales are not fixed are they???

Yes I understand I am the buyers agent. I represent the buyer, so I have a duty to tell him not to pay more than the property if wotrth. I can not believe you can't comprehend that. Or are so unethical that you think I should let him pay $500,000 just to get a larger commission.

[mission vending]

It is unfortunate that some people think forums are places they can go to pick fights and argue with people. If you want to do that you can go to a political forum where you know you can fight with people all you like.

I gave a reasoned opinion. That does not mean I don't want to hear other reasoned opinions. We can differ and even debate ideas, but I have no desire to waste my time fighting with people who have such low self esteme that everything becomes a personal offense to them. No person offense could possibly have been meant as I did not know the people getting angry before I made my comments.

Bill, In any online forum the ONLY way anyone can make interpretations is to read what is posted. We lose the ability hear, see and speak in this format as well as the ability to gain the personal knowledge of knowing someone in a work or friend relationship over time. As such, though the intent was probably not there, on several occasions in this thread your remarks, IMO, could easily be taken to be arrogant and condescending.

One thing to remember is that EVERYONE'S response has value. They may not have dozens of boxes out or a lot of experience either. It may not be what you are looking for but you are also not required to take all the advice that is offered. What is given is given freely and take from it what you think will work for you. In this community here it is not only the information that is offered it is the support and friendship that makes this place special. For just about all of us, our friends outside of vending just don't get what this business is like. That newbie that you so casually disregard just might be the person that restates something in a way that makes it click for you that no one else has been able to do.

I'm not going to converse with people who take personal offense any more.

Like I said above, all we get is the words you post, using the word "stupid" when referring to the standard business model that is used is a great way to offend everyone and get the results you have been getting.

It seems this thread has lost focus. The topic is CoGS and whether one should strive to lower costs by putting in product of less value or maintain higher value product at a higher CoGS.

1. I beleive you have more theft if your customers feel they are being ripped off. If you rip them off they will rip you off.

2. You will have more sales if you have a value product.

3. If there is little perceived value you will loose the account

4. The average markup in retail has always been 100%. Therefor a at $1.00 you need to have an average price of your product of 50 cents. Less than that causes 1 & 2 & 3 above.

If you disagree please, explain why the points I made are wrong. I would love explanitory responses to each point or even one or two. Also, does anyone agree with any of my points?

I don't have any honor boxes but I have nearly 20 years in vending so maybe my comments will be considered credible by you.....or not. At initial glance your idea sounds interesting going with a "value proposition" is something I have not seen or heard of in honor boxes. I do hope you follow through and let everyone know about your results, good or bad. regarding your 4 points:

1. From my experience your theft or shrinkage will have a more direct relationship to the demographics at the location, young blue collar will have higher shrinkage than older white collar environment.

2. People have a limited amount of discretionary income, in this day and age I don't see a value proposition as being able to get more $$ out the customer. Especially when in most cases they can still get the same item cheaper at the grocery store and "brown bag" it. You are not selling value you are selling convenience.

3. The sustainability of the account in this service based industry is more about the relationships you establish than about what you are selling and at what price point.

4. Your shrinkage will be reflected in your COGS, if you lose 10% then you COGS will increase by that amount. With a high initial COGS you have little margin for error. At some point your cost to service makes the location unprofitable and that's before you give a % to a nonprofit. To get a understanding of the cost to service concept: http://vendiscuss.net/index.php?/topic/8150-cost-to-service/

[dogcow]

I think it will lower theft a little maybe 5%, that is not the brunt of my arguement. I beleive the difference will be made up in in volume and in maintaining accounts. Points 2 & 3, (you know the ones you are ignoring). Yes, if you assume no increase in volume lower CoGS is better, obviously. You are no genius for saying lower CoGS is better given the same volume. But sales are not fixed are they???

u need to look at the numbers a little more, @ 5% theft w/ ~50% cogs ur losing $2.50 vs 20% theft w/ ~20% cogs , $4.00 , the gain is only 1.50 but the diff in theft margin is 15 items!, so if its closer to 20% than 5% (experience says that is likely) ur gonna lose a lot of money

as far as the other points, they are irrelevant in honor boxes, the over all volume of the biz matters more than the volume of 1 location, and its not a vending machine so if the volume sucks just pull it and move it somewhere else. the accounts are basically disposable because they are so easy to get and theres no real investment or effort to pick up and move the box. as far as geting kicked out there is basically 1 reason u will get kicked out and thats a regional manager doesnt like it there, honor box accts for the most part will let u keep the acct as long as u care to be there. basically honor box is a business of relocating until you end up

with the route you want in terms of theft and volume.

with 100 item box u need to be a bit more selective because most accts dont need that much which is why i used smaller boxes if it needed more items id just place two of them.

as far as cogs, use smaller chips, lance crackers,etc.. to bring down cogs, i kept candy and pastry items less than 15% of the box in most accounts unless they specifically requested it and had shown to be good payers. the biggest selling & highest profit item is chips, so u want to fit more chips than anything else in there that is why i use the 1oz chips aside from the fact its more proifit to charge $1 for 1oz than LSS, just look at a vending machine most machines are stocked around 45% with chips and other similar items( pretzels ,etc..)

[bill123]

u need to look at the numbers a little more, @ 5% theft w/ ~50% cogs ur losing $2.50 vs 20% theft w/ ~20% cogs , $4.00 , the gain is only 1.50 but the diff in theft margin is 15 items!, so if its closer to 20% than 5% (experience says that is likely) ur gonna lose a lot of money

as far as the other points, they are irrelevant in honor boxes, the over all volume of the biz matters more than the volume of 1 location, and its not a vending machine so if the volume sucks just pull it and move it somewhere else. the accounts are basically disposable because they are so easy to get and theres no real investment or effort to pick up and move the box. as far as geting kicked out there is basically 1 reason u will get kicked out and thats a regional manager doesnt like it there, honor box accts for the most part will let u keep the acct as long as u care to be there. basically honor box is a business of relocating until you end up

with the route you want in terms of theft and volume.

with 100 item box u need to be a bit more selective because most accts dont need that much which is why i used smaller boxes if it needed more items id just place two of them.

as far as cogs, use smaller chips, lance crackers,etc.. to bring down cogs, i kept candy and pastry items less than 15% of the box in most accounts unless they specifically requested it and had shown to be good payers. the biggest selling & highest profit item is chips, so u want to fit more chips than anything else in there that is why i use the 1oz chips aside from the fact its more proifit to charge $1 for 1oz than LSS, just look at a vending machine most machines are stocked around 45% with chips and other similar items( pretzels ,etc..)

Mission vending, thankyou

Dogcow, you don't listen well. I said a 5% difference in the theft rate, not a 5% theft rate. That would mean 15% instead of 20%. And we will see because in a few weeks we will have actual result to talk about. You seem very intent on finding ways to argue. Points 2&3 are not irrelevant, they may turn out to have less value than I think, but they are relevant. On the 100 item box - I will be having 3 levels of boxes, but I start with the largest for the 1st week to guage the demand.

Chips are already cheap. I'm not going to put 1oz chips in to bring my chip costs from 36 cent to 22. If I did that people would take more 52 cent snacks. I'm with you on pastries the shelf life is too short. I do 8% pastries. Candy bars are what people want. I am at about 30% Chocolat Candy bars and 10% non chocolat. Chips has six times the volume as bars so you are correct that I want more chips, but because of space I don't have the percentage I would like. I figure better to have 6 bars than one bag will produce more sales. My chips are at 20%, I wish I had the space for more. I've tried to stay as close to the demand percentages as possible, but shelf life and space force me to make some adjustments. After I get a relationship going i will try leaving a box of chip and ask a secretary or someone to refill.

[dogcow]

Mission vending, thankyou

Dogcow, you don't listen well. I said a 5% difference in the theft rate, not a 5% theft rate. That would mean 15% instead of 20%. And we will see because in a few weeks we will have actual result to talk about. You seem very intent on finding ways to argue. Points 2&3 are not irrelevant, they may turn out to have less value than I think, but they are relevant. On the 100 item box - I will be having 3 levels of boxes, but I start with the largest for the 1st week to guage the demand.

Chips are already cheap. I'm not going to put 1oz chips in to bring my chip costs from 36 cent to 22. If I did that people would take more 52 cent snacks. I'm with you on pastries the shelf life is too short. I do 8% pastries. Candy bars are what people want. I am at about 30% Chocolat Candy bars and 10% non chocolat. Chips has six times the volume as bars so you are correct that I want more chips, but because of space I don't have the percentage I would like. I figure better to have 6 bars than one bag will produce more sales. My chips are at 20%, I wish I had the space for more. I've tried to stay as close to the demand percentages as possible, but shelf life and space force me to make some adjustments. After I get a relationship going i will try leaving a box of chip and ask a secretary or someone to refill.

if u dont have any boxes out how do you know demand percentages. speaking from experience ur all wrong here.

first of all it varies wildly by the type of acct...offices want mostly pastries...they will sell very fast i never worried about

the date on them because they sold great. in fact some operators even use a side car with 100% pasteries.

chocolate is hit and miss, it wont sell nearly as fast as u think it does, the good thing is if its kept right u can turn it a million times

until the package starts to look really bad because it doesnt really expire for a few years. for the most part i didnt put much chocolate and even what i did put was usually sent back from most accts. many accts are non air conditioned so u cant even put chocolate anyway, those are some of the best accts . when i went out locating i kept the chocolate in baggies in a cooler, if the acct looked like it didnt have AC i wouldnt put the chocolate in the box, if it did, i would. (the way ur locating is all wrong too but thats another story) those blue collar accts they want nuts and chips and other things that are very filling. some pastry like pop tarts but no chocolate or chocolate donuts. granola bars surprisingly do well in the blue collar accts because they are filling, they do good in offices too mainly right after new years (jan/feb) adn drop off towards the summer .

forget the 22c chips i used half lays and half wise (18c chips with 6mo expiry!) and the TGIF which i thnik is around 18-19 cent range

anyway so far as driving sales from the cheaper margin snacks to the higher ones, it simply does not happen. people eat something

because they want to eat it , they wont pay $1 for a snickers if they want chips but its a 1oz chips. people who use honor boxes like most vending are people who are short sighted and bad with money decisions. ur way over thinking it. the only thing u can do to control what snacks someone eats is split pricing. if u have something like $0.50 for chips and crackers/ $1.00 for candy pastry no one will ever eat the candy or pastry eventually they will just tell u to stop bringing it altogether because it takes up room for the cheap stuff. dont do that make everything a buck, or 2 for one.

i sold cases and cases of lance crackers thru my honor boxes, that is someone paying $1 for a pack of crackers that cost 15 cents.

every once in a while people will complain about the 1oz chips, i just tell them look sometimes people forget to pay me here and there so the difference makes up for it. for example if someone takes a snickers and forgets to pay, and someone else buys a bag

of chips, it makes up for the difference. everyone understands this i never lost an acct due to the price, most people said my prices were evry good (because how would they know they dont have any frame of reference)

[bill123]

dogcow,

"if u dont have any boxes out how do you know demand percentages. speaking from experience ur all wrong here." - I cited industry sources on this thread already. I can't be "all" wrong as my mix was from the vending and food industry reports that specifically studied vending and convienent store. Not exactly the same, but certainly close enough to start. But as I mentioned i have to adjust the pasteries for spoilage and chip for space. I also realize I will have to make more adjustments when I see the result, but I got it close enough that with such a large initial box people will not miss something they prefer.

first of all it varies wildly by the type of acct...offices want mostly pastries...they will sell very fast i never worried about

the date on them because they sold great. in fact some operators even use a side car with 100% pasteries. - That is why I use my largest of 3 packs for the 1st week, so there is plenty of everything and I can adjust. I have 3 standard sizes, I bring in the appropriate size and then add what is selling there. I expected pastries would be higher at offices, but now I learned they will be higher than I thought, thankyou.

chocolate is hit and miss, it wont sell nearly as fast as u think it does, the good thing is if its kept right u can turn it a million times

until the package starts to look really bad because it doesnt really expire for a few years. for the most part i didnt put much chocolate and even what i did put was usually sent back from most accts. many accts are non air conditioned so u cant even put chocolate anyway, those are some of the best accts . when i went out locating i kept the chocolate in baggies in a cooler, if the acct looked like it didnt have AC i wouldnt put the chocolate in the box, if it did, i would. (the way ur locating is all wrong too but thats another story) those blue collar accts they want nuts and chips and other things that are very filling. some pastry like pop tarts but no chocolate or chocolate donuts. granola bars surprisingly do well in the blue collar accts because they are filling, they do good in offices too mainly right after new years (jan/feb) adn drop off towards the summer . - agree, I am careful with that and emphasis keeping it out of the sun and putting it in a cool clace. Please tell me what is wrong and how I should be locating. (currently, I hit the factory area by foot the 1st day, andthe next day I telemarketed an area, the next day I targeted specifically real estate by phone.)

i sold cases and cases of lance crackers thru my honor boxes, that is someone paying $1 for a pack of crackers that cost 15 cents. - You can't be sure they paid $1, maybe they paid 50 cents and that is where some shrinkage is coming from. I have some crackers.

I need to make a correction - I bought some variety packs on a lot of the cand bars, therefor my CoGS is 50%, not 52

[GW13]

my advice to you is stop getting caught up with COGS numbers.....50%, 52%, 28% whatever.....all that matters is overall profit....put in a good mix of products that SELL, crack down on shortages, and GROW the business.....people waste too much time playing with numbers as a way to procrastinate

[bill123]

my advice to you is stop getting caught up with COGS numbers.....50%, 52%, 28% whatever.....all that matters is overall profit....put in a good mix of products that SELL, crack down on shortages, and GROW the business.....people waste too much time playing with numbers as a way to procrastinate

UR right

[dogcow]

- You can't be sure they paid $1, maybe they paid 50 cents and that is where some shrinkage is coming from. I have some crackers.

because before i closed out my route all my accounts were paying almost 100% every time,i cut everyone that was poor payers

as for locating , forget email, and pretty much forget the phone. u can get locations on the phone sort of but mostly its a waste of time because u still have to go to the location to place the box and often times they change their mind when u get there plus ur route will be all scattershot, it wont really be a route per se just a bunch of locations. this is kind of OK in some other types of vending because u can do collections infrequently OR you are collecting a big amount of money each time, but wih honor boxes u have to have a tight route of cost to service will eat you alive, because a lot of times ur just collecting 10 or 20 bucks .

honor box is simplest business there is...u make the boxes , u put the boxes in ur car. you drive down the road until you hit a strip mall with some retail, barber shops, nail shops, car repair, banks, etc.. get out and start placing the boxes. my philosophy is i want to get as many locations as i can without starting the car again . so in a strip mall i want to try to get at least 2 locations, or an office park,etc... that way i can stop the car, do a few locations without having to drive anywhere. thats why i did mostly stirp malls, medical office parks and industrial parks. u can do office buildings for the same reason but in my area they just dont have that many

honor box is a slam dunk kind of sale, not a finesse kind of sale, i bring in the box so they have no opportunity to say no, some people leave it in the car and thats fine but always have it WITH YOU when u go to make the sale. when i first started i used a locator for a few locations he would not even bother checking with the manager if the mgr wasnt around. he would just leave it with whoever was there and tell them to have the mgr call me if they decided they didnt want it. personally i was a little more picky than that cause it was a hassle to go back later and re-sell the mgr or collect the box but to be honest 50% of the time on those the mgr would not really care so it is an effective tactic.

this guy i used he was doing it for many years he would put out 10-12 boxes from 9am to 11am , i am not nearly that good but its such an easy sale (you arent even 'selling' anything) i can do a few an hour. its very tedious work but its so easy. i gave a lot of thought to doing honor boxes full time the way i figure u need to block out at least a day or two every week to locate because some % of ur accounts will be duds after the 1st or 2nd cycle and need to be relocated . my plan was similar to what dennis describe in the other thread except i would keep 2 days a week exclusively for locating, either expanding or re-locating until i had enough volume to hire a ft route driver. i ended up getting a better ftj so i never bothered with it and ended up closing out my route instead

as someone else said here, if ur not comfortable with face to face sales, u can probably hire someone off craigs list to do the sales part for you, its not very hard if u have a basic rebuttals list. it just can get expensive. the guy i used wanted 30 per location which is too high, i would need to be 5-10 bucks per location to make it work for me, even then if they are halfway good it adds up to real big money at the end of the day for the sales guy

[mainor5251]

i felt like i gained nothing from this thread except the desire to kick someone in the face with a steel toed boot, sorry if i wasnt as enlighting has everyone else in this thread for i'm just a uneducated, poor redneck living in the south!

[dogcow]

i felt like i gained nothing from this thread except the desire to kick someone in the face with a steel toed boot, sorry if i wasnt as enlighting has everyone else in this thread for i'm just a uneducated, poor redneck living in the south!

i feel bad for the inmates!

[mission vending]

i feel bad for the inmates!

Yeah, me too, I bet that they had a bad day today!!

[mainor5251]

Yeah, me too, I bet that they had a bad day today!!

been off since friday morning

[mattlibman]

I agree with OPs premise.