////// Strange noise from a Crane 147 snack machine ///////

[andyinchville]

Hi guys,

I'm looking at buying a Crane 147 snack machine from a vendor in Richmond.

The machine had been broken into, but apparently there is little if any cosmetic damage.

The owner of the machine says that the changer was messed up (as a result of the break in), so he replaced the changer with a new unit.

Apparently there is a problem with a strange noise when the machine is plugged in that sometimes results in the circuit breaker on the machine kicking off… I asked the man if it was the sound of the bill validator Clicking as the machine is powered up, but he indicated that it was not that type of noise.

Short of a vend motor trying to turn and not being able to turn I can't figure what type of noise a machine make? I'm assuming that the circuit breaker on the machine kicking is probably the result of a frayed or shorted wire?

Oh, before I forget, he did say something about a code "ER" appearing on the display......... how does one go about figuring out what the ER means? I'm assuming it means error.

Also, just curious, what would you think a machine like this would be worth in its current state? How hard you think it would be to repair this machine?

Thanks in advance for any and all help.

Andrew

[AZVendor]

You are encountering what I dislike about National equipment. They are cryptic and kind of complicated too. I haven't found anything in a 147 manual about the ER you saw, but you might actually be looking at a Glasco GS1 or 2. In the Glasco you can pull out the door switch and the machine will immediately show any errors. Write the codes down and report them. The Glasco manual only lists 2 - TC ERROR for a tray column problem and SERIAL VAL for a validator problem. Try this even if its a National 147 (both machine serial numbers begin with 147).

There are 3 boards in these machines, the power board that supplies coin mech and validator power, the snack interface board and the main controller board. The circuit breakers on the front of the power supply are for the 110v side of the machine. The lower breaker is .5 amp and is on the machine side of the line filter before the transformer. The upper breaker on a plain unchilled snack machine is 3 amps and is on the line voltage coming into the machine.

If there was a coin mech problem from before, you may have a problem with the power board to the mech and validator. Try to find out if the old mech was ripped out while the machine was on. This could have caused a short when they ripped the plug out. The only way to narrow down the cause of the breaker tripping is to know how long it takes to trip, then unplug the mech and validator. Wait for that time period to see if the light or anything on the 110v side up to and including the transformer causes the problem. If not then power off and plug in the coin mech. Power up and wait the time period. If the breaker trips the problem is in the coin mech circuit; the mech, power board or harness. If no problem, connect the validator and wait again. You need to narrow the problem down to its cause. Something is drawing too much current and it's going to be on the 110v side.

[AngryChris]

You should check to see if the machine has a fan. I am not saying that it will be responsible for a clicking noise but those exhaust fans can often make all kind of noises when they are going bad. If you have one, it should be located above the top tray near the back of the cabinet. I had one give me some temporary insanity on a refreshtron a while ago, until I disconnected it.

[andyinchville]

HI Guys,

Thanks for the help...Turns out for whatever reason it was the circuit board (maybe it tried to make motors turn?)...The fella in Richmond had a tech come out and test everything...The previous owner will have a new board installed and test the machine out before selling it to me.

I don't know how they figured it would be a circuit board making noise (I can understand a hum if something was seriously messed up electrically) but other than that I would have guessed something more mechanical.

I'll wait for them to call back w/ the results BUT I did mention to them your answers above.

Thanks again for the help and input.

Andrew

[AZVendor]

This is probably all related to the previous vandalism when the coin mech was damaged or stolen. Because this likely took place when the machine was powered up, the board was probably damaged. This could cause any number of problems and it trying to run multiple motors would not be unheard of. The new board will hopefully fix it. Be careful though, that the coin mech could possibly now have been damaged by the bad board, and could then damage the new board that will be put in.

If any noise was coming from the board itself, then that's an indication that one of the solid state devices on the board has failed. This could be a relay, rectifier, choke or small power transistor.