Important for every type of operator

[Frank]

I have been following this forum for a while now.  At first it was addicting to see all of the talk about the chicken, then all the sales that followed.  Now, I agree enough!  For those of you that like it, great.  For those that don’t, I respect that.  There shouldn’t be anyone pushing the chicken so much.  We, as an industry have much more pressing issues where we should be spending our time. 

 

The most important issue I believe for all of us is the Dollar Coin.  To those of you that have lived the Dollar Coin push days of years ago, I believe it is different this time.  Senator Kennedy is no longer in office to protect the Dollar Bill printing in his district.  Senator McCain is pushing for it greatly.  Over a decade ago, Rep. Peter King was interested in helping our industry introduce it to Congress.  Today, he is considering running for President. 

 

I ask each of you to consider spending a few minutes that will cost you nothing but your time and maybe a stamp. 

 

If each and every one of us takes the time to write our local Congress Representative, US Senator, Governor and maybe even a few local news agencies someone will pick it up.  If our voice is heard on this topic, just maybe someone in the lower ranks looking to make a name for themselves might take on this issue and become vocal in trying to replace the dollar bill.  For the operator with just one location, you do not realize what the dollar coin can do for you.

 

Senator McCain ran for President.  He has the power and the voice to make this change.  We need to stand behind him and help him spread his message.

 

The Dollar Coin Alliance has set up a page on its website to get your local member of Congress.  Click on the link and email your local representative: 

 

http://wfc2.wiredforchange.com/o/9022/p/dia/action/public/?action_KEY=6478

 

The following link is for a list of your US Senate members:

 

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

 

The following link is for a list of US Governors:

 

http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Governors.shtml

 

 

 

The time is now for us to become the leaders of our industry for the next generation.  Our voice can be heard.  Just look what we have done with the chicken or other pieces of equipment.  If we unify together, we just might be able to better our industry.

 

Regards,

 

Frank

 

 

[mission vending]

I have been following this forum for a while now.  At first it was addicting to see all of the talk about the chicken, then all the sales that followed.  Now, I agree enough!  For those of you that like it, great.  For those that don’t, I respect that.  There shouldn’t be anyone pushing the chicken so much.  We, as an industry have much more pressing issues where we should be spending our time. 

 

The most important issue I believe for all of us is the Dollar Coin.  To those of you that have lived the Dollar Coin push days of years ago, I believe it is different this time.  Senator Kennedy is no longer in office to protect the Dollar Bill printing in his district.  Senator McCain is pushing for it greatly.  Over a decade ago, Rep. Peter King was interested in helping our industry introduce it to Congress.  Today, he is considering running for President. 

 

I ask each of you to consider spending a few minutes that will cost you nothing but your time and maybe a stamp. 

 

If each and every one of us takes the time to write our local Congress Representative, US Senator, Governor and maybe even a few local news agencies someone will pick it up.  If our voice is heard on this topic, just maybe someone in the lower ranks looking to make a name for themselves might take on this issue and become vocal in trying to replace the dollar bill.  For the operator with just one location, you do not realize what the dollar coin can do for you.

 

Senator McCain ran for President.  He has the power and the voice to make this change.  We need to stand behind him and help him spread his message.

 

The Dollar Coin Alliance has set up a page on its website to get your local member of Congress.  Click on the link and email your local representative: 

 

http://wfc2.wiredforchange.com/o/9022/p/dia/action/public/?action_KEY=6478

 

The following link is for a list of your US Senate members:

 

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

 

The following link is for a list of US Governors:

 

http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Governors.shtml

 

 

 

The time is now for us to become the leaders of our industry for the next generation.  Our voice can be heard.  Just look what we have done with the chicken or other pieces of equipment.  If we unify together, we just might be able to better our industry.

 

Regards,

 

Frank

 

A most excellent post Frank, I have do so in the past and will again because I think general acceptance of the dollar coin will also benefit full line vending as much as bulk.

[Smiley]

Excellent post Frank. I would just like to add we should also be using Facebook and twitter to contact important legislators. The efforts should be coordinated by someone for maximum effect.

[mainor5251]

One of the main complaints I have seen was the lack of "In God We Trust" on the coins. If you hear or see this, educate people. They began producing the $1 presidential coins in 2007. Starting with Washington they produced 4 coins that year and every year since in order when they served in office. Only the 4 in 2007 and the 4 in 2008 are without "In God We Trust" on the face of the coin, everyone since has it.

[caserri]

Indeed, a great post Frank. I applaud your intent but unfortunately, this type of change will not happen due to a letter writing campaign. Nothing ever changes due to letter writing. 99.9% of the letters will end up in the recycle bin without ever being opened.

I'm not saying this will never come about but if it does, it will not be because of millions of letters. Sad to say but in this day and age, change, whether good or bad, only comes by force or money.

Wait a minute! We have opportunity for peaceful and free change every 4 years in the elections you say? Hogwash. I stand by my assertion that NOTHING changes each election. Its a sham and the sheeple fall for it every time.

[SAH50]

"Sad to say but in this day and age, change, whether good or bad, only comes by force or money."

No pun intended. Lol. Or maybe intended?

[Frank]

Indeed, a great post Frank. I applaud your intent but unfortunately, this type of change will not happen due to a letter writing campaign. Nothing ever changes due to letter writing. 99.9% of the letters will end up in the recycle bin without ever being opened.

I'm not saying this will never come about but if it does, it will not be because of millions of letters. Sad to say but in this day and age, change, whether good or bad, only comes by force or money.

Wait a minute! We have opportunity for peaceful and free change every 4 years in the elections you say? Hogwash. I stand by my assertion that NOTHING changes each election. Its a sham and the sheeple fall for it every time.

 

 

Those who want to achieve will find a way; those who do not will find an excuse.  - William A. Ward

 

Those who believe they can and those who believe they can't are both right.

[caserri]

Those who want to achieve will find a way; those who do not will find an excuse. - William A. Ward

Ahhh. I love quotes!

Unfortunately quotes are very much like letter writing campaigns. They give people the false impression that they can do anything.

I would edit Mr. Ward's quote to read...

"Those who want to achieve will find a way; those who do not will find a reason."

I'm a realist. We don't make excuses, we give reasons.

[Frank]

I am a realist too.  I have witnessed many beneficial changes to Federal, State and Municipal laws that have been changed by our Association.  All it took was an idea from a fellow bulk vending operator and our Association came together to change many laws.

 

Take number 7, this was done simply because one day my father realized he and other manufacturers were not manufacturing toys in the United States anymore.  He went to the library and looked up the law.  He thought of the idea, went to his friend and Association Attorney Morrie Much and they took it to Congress.  Today, if you purchased bulk vending toys, you do not have import tax on toys.. now that’s being a realist.

 

Courtesy of the NBVA website, This is REAL…

 

1.            Gambling Excise. In 1950 the main problem was to defeat the attempt of the US. Treasury Department to impose gambling excise taxes on our machines. This battle was won but the ramifications of the effort were felt in the industry for several years and similar gambling claims were fought at various state levels as well.

 

 

2.            Commingling. The Food and Drug Administration attempted to ban the commingling of charms with ball gum. The initial challenge by the FDA took place by administrative ruling and court enforcement. The industry responded with its own lawsuit and we were successful in the U.S. Court of Appeals in Virginia in the now famous Cavelier Vending case which established as a matter of law that the commingling of charms and ball gum is not hazardous to health.

 

 

3.            Health Concerns. The FDA did not give up easily, however, and next attempted to ban the commingling by introducing a special legislation in Congress which would have the same effect of banning the commingling. Again the NBVA responded with a lobbying effort which established the congressional precedent of favorable legislation affecting our industry.

 

 

4.            Viewfinder. The “viewfinder” was introduced by the industry for a short period of time as a method of eliminating one of the three essential elements of gambling. By placing the viewfinder in the machines in such a way as to identify the item vended, the element of chance was removed and therefore gambling could not be present. As you may recall, to constitute gambling in our machines, there must be a consideration paid for a prize and there must be an element of chance. The NBVA also argued that the viewfinder was not required since the element of “prize” is not present in our machines due to the fact that the items vended are of approximate or equivalent value to the coin being inserted.

 

 

5.            Bulk Vending Definition. The NBVA created the definition of “bulk vending machines” which has been used successfully in numerous states, counties and cities in obtaining relief from sales taxes and license fees. We compose materials for use in explaining how our industry differs from the balance of the “vending industry” in order to justify separate treatment.

 

 

6.            Toy Safety Law. When the Toy Safety Act was first introduced in Congress, our representatives were present and attempted to generate testimony on the floor of the House of Representatives to minimize the impact of the legislation. There was no possibility of defeating the entire legislation since the Act was intended at other items, including bulk vending products.

 

 

7.            Tariff Exemption. In 1982, the NBVA spearheaded a successful drive to obtain a temporary tariff exemption which significantly reduced the cost of importing our small toys and novelties. The temporary exemption was renewed and extended in 1986 and in 1990. That relief expired on December 31, 1992, but we obtained permanent exemption under the GATT. (See Item 15.)

 

 

8.            Mandatory Labeling. In 1991 we expressed objections to legislation sponsored by the Consumer Product Safety Commission to require labeling of small toys. The labeling requirement was rejected by Congress.

 

 

9.            Tax Video. In 1992, we produced a tax video to be used as a training vehicle for our members, and as materials to be shown to legislators in battling licensing and sales taxes.

 

 

10.          Voluntary Labeling. In 1992, the Consumer Product Safety Commission withdrew its proposed mandatory labeling requirements for small toys, marbles and balloons and the NBVA rescinded the voluntary labeling standard we adopted in 1991. Meanwhile, the Child Safety Protection Act was introduced in 1993 to impose almost identical labeling requirements. We succeeded in limiting the labels on our machines, rather than on each capsule.

 

 

11.          ADA Rules. In 1992, we issued a bulletin on the Americans with Disabilities Act and furnished sample response to letters from store owners and managers.

 

 

12.          Legislative Fund. In 1993 our members voluntarily pledged close to $50,000 to fight the VAT tax being considered and to prepare to fight for other national issues.

 

 

13.          $1.00 Coin. Since 1993, we have been committed to support legislation for the $1.00 coin. We continue to support this legislation by our renewed membership in The Coin Coalition. When the $1 coin legislation is finally passed, the effects on our marketing and profit potential will be enormous.

 

 

14.          Toy Safety Act of 1994. We supported the mandatory labeling requirements of this new act on the condition federal preemption was established. First we ensured that labeling is not required on each capsule. Through our efforts, the Toy Safety Act of 1994 specifically deals with our machines.

 

 

15.          GATT Exemption. In 1994 we were successful in being included in the negotiated GATT schedules for permanent relief from tariffs on small toys which cost  8¢or less. Since GATT passed and became effective, the bulk vending industry has saved well over $1 million per year. Additionally, the Association no longer needs to retain a Washington lobbyist every few years to seek extension of our tariff relief.

 

 

16.          Toy Safety Final Regulations. We commented on proposed regulations and were instrumental in obtaining favorable provisions in the final regulations adopted by the Consumer Product Safety Commission in 1995. In 1997, we obtained approval of specific wording for multiple products.

 

 

17.          Blue Sky Promoters Banned.  In 1997 we amended our Constitution and By-Laws to take a strong stand against unscrupulous promoters who use false or deceptive materials to deceive investors.  We specifically condemned the use of “multiplication charts” and the erroneous reference to “net profits” in a misleading manner.

 

 

18.          Special legislation in the CPSIA of 2008. As a direct result of The NBVA’s efforts before the CPSC, and on Capitol Hill, each individual bulk vended product does not have to bear a tracking label.  The CPSC guidance explicitly states that, “if a product is sold through a bulk vending machine, the item does not need to be individually marked but the package or carton in which such products are shipped to the retailer should be marked.

 

 

19.          Nutritional Labeling. The NBVA met with the FDA and received an exemption to section 4205 of the Affordable Health Care act, requiring bulk vending machines to list nutritional information.

[caserri]

I am a realist too. I have witnessed many beneficial changes to Federal, State and Municipal laws that have been changed by our Association.

Changed by your "Association".

Changes brought forth by the actions of an association is not what I'm talking about. Yes, these are all great and positive changes, no doubt. I am not disputing the fact that change CAN happen. My point, as stated in a previous post in case you missed it, is that change only comes about by force or money. I would venture a guess that your "Association" had the funds required for such changes to take place. A letter writing campaign is not going to bring about these changes. Politicians will not move on an issue if there is no money in it. The only way a letter writing campaign has any chance of working is if you stuff the envelopes with hundred dollar bills!

I'm not trying to debate your motives. I said in my initial post that it's a great idea. What I am trying to do is have you think about the obvious solution to this without me having to say it. You are old enough and wise enough to know what I'm talking about.

Think.

[Frank]

What are you talking about??

[mission vending]

I think one of the most effective things members can do around is to join our trade associations, NBVA, AMOA or NAMA. The annual dues are relatively modest and IMO well worth it. I'd be willing to bet there is only a handful of members here that are members.

By joining we not only support them financially but also add to their strength of numbers.

[rxmark]

Steve,

So your basically saying its not worth trying to change something unless you have lots of money to buy someone off? So if we all called our representitives right now all at once nothing would get done? They wouldn't read our letters and wouldn't take our calls but they will only take our money and our votes? It sounds like you given up on alot of things in life and have no fight left in you. Nothing will ever get done if noone does anything to change it. Isn't this what frank is talking about?

Kind of like when a route goes up for sale and you never call because you think you don't have enough money to buy it but instead let your competitor buy it because they have the fight in them to put in an offer.

Being negative will get you nowhere. Being positive at least gives it a chance to change. There is honest people who represent us I guess you will never find them if your voice is never heard no matter how it is spoken.

[caserri]

Steve,

So your basically saying its not worth trying to change something unless you have lots of money to buy someone off? So if we all called our representitives right now all at once nothing would get done? They wouldn't read our letters and wouldn't take our calls but they will only take our money and our votes? It sounds like you given up on alot of things in life and have no fight left in you. Nothing will ever get done if noone does anything to change it. Isn't this what frank is talking about?

Kind of like when a route goes up for sale and you never call because you think you don't have enough money to buy it but instead let your competitor buy it because they have the fight in them to put in an offer.

Being negative will get you nowhere. Being positive at least gives it a chance to change. There is honest people who represent us I guess you will never find them if your voice is never heard no matter how it is spoken.

That's exactly what I'm saying. Life sucks.

Edit: I forgot the "THEN YOU DIE" part.

[caserri]

I guess everyone is hearing...

But nooooooobody is listening.

[caserri]

You know, I'm a fairly open minded guy. Maybe I am being a bit stubborn here. I will sit down and write my letter tonight then drop it in the mail first thing in the morning.

How long must I wait to see this change you speak of?

[Makes Cents]

In a way, I agree with what caserri is saying. The system is broken. For a while now our laws have been voted in under the influence of large special interest groups, unions and lobbyists. Deep pockets and influence equals votes its that simple. Im not saying its futile to try to change things politically, it can be done and maybe it should be done, if for no other reason than to make a statement, but its a long shot.

My best efforts in effecting positive change in my life and my business is left to me, not the government, not politicians, not trade organizations.

[Smiley]

In the current climate, very little is getting done at the federal level. At the state and local level it is possible to get things done with persistence by smaller groups. Yes, groups, associations. And money must be spent usually. Lobbyists from different sides giving their opinions. Everyone hates lobbyists but you really don't expect legislators to know how every law would effect everyone, do you?

 

Sure their are abuses, but there are plenty of amazing stories about how small groups got laws changed. Frank just gave you one. If you have a few hours to spare, call up Roger Folz and ask him about his lobbying. You can't believe what 1 man has done to get laws passed.

 

You really don't  want a system where it's too easy to change laws either.

[Frank]

 My best efforts in effecting positive change in my life and my business is left to me, not the government, not politicians, not trade organizations.

 

 

If the Dollar Bill is eliminated and the Dollar Coin comes into play, do you know that your sales will increase 30%

 

Then, what if we follow  50 cent vending (2 quarters).  Imagine a two coin - $2 vend?  

 

Many charity guys on here can say they do not operate 2 inch capsules.  Ok, I understand.  But, that bar you are in, why not increase to a Dollar Vend on your small machine giving out more?  Why not try expensive, name brand candies?  How about the break rooms or any other places you might have machines in.  

 

I hear many people saying that a $300 DBA is expensive. Whats your cost now when you have the coin?  $20 to convert, if that??

 

Think of all the savings then think of all the increase in business.

 

Our Government as a whole is a good, productive government.  Change does happen every day.  Maybe not what you want, maybe not what you need, but it does help the greater good.  Support our Government, support our Vending trade Associations and support each operator on here.  

[Frank]

 

Sure their are abuses, but there are plenty of amazing stories about how small groups got laws changed. Frank just gave you one. If you have a few hours to spare, call up Roger Folz and ask him about his lobbying. You can't believe what 1 man has done to get laws passed.

 

 

 

Thanks Dave, you and I have grown up seeing these efforts come to pass.  Yow being in the next town over, you have witnessed first hand what Roger had accomplished and I have to say other operators as well.  For the past five years, in Roger's retirement days, you know how he shows me all of his accomplishments weekly.  I have read changes in laws going back to the 50's when I was only born in the 70's.  Our industry has changed so many laws.  Instead of supporting our fellow suppliers and operators, operators are quick to knock each other and put down any progress.  But, rather focus on giving away high commissions to hurt the other vendor.  It was not like this when bulk vending started.  Operators Dave such as your grandfather, my family, the Folz's and many others made real money because they worked hard and worked together.  Not everyone liked each other, but they supported each other.  Your grandfather and Roger were fierce competitors, any chance each of them had to get a store they took.  But when one of them had an idea to better our industry, they supported each other.  Today, if an operator has a good idea, we automatically attack them.

[musser]

Thank you Frank for your very informative post, your great attitude, and your great faith in this wonderful country.

Our government, system, country is not broken. That's hogwash and an excuse for not getting up in the morning and working your golpher off.

Whatever state has tax relief for bulk vending that relief came about through lobbying at a personal level by individuals interacting with legislators. Yes money was spent, it was spent on professional guidance so people could interact intelligently. And yes, most of the change came about because of the work of the NBVA and its operators.

I can tell you first hand that writing letters makes a difference. Meeting law makers in person makes a difference.

Everyone should get behind this.

And now for a bit of advise in the hope that at least one person follows it. If you think you cannot make a difference or change your life, spend some money and buy a basic Tony Robbins course and actually do the course. It will enrich and empower you.

I cannot remember the quote exactly or the author but: "there are no great men, just average men that rise to greatness in times of great challenges".

[moondog]

If one were to tally up the total cost of the special equipment that has been purchased by just the Full Line Vendors of this forum alone. it would run into the millions of dollars.  Oh, we thought it was a good idea to give our customers as many payment options as possible and I think we still feel that way as we contemplate cashless payment systems.  But the people have spoken regarding the one dollar coin and the last time I heard, this was still a government based on the principle of "by the people, for the people".

 

In the meantime, I've some good "slightly used" one dollar coin mechs sitting here I could make you a sweet deal on as they're of no use to me.

[Frank]

.  Oh, we thought it was a good idea to give our customers as many payment options as possible and I think we still feel that way as we contemplate cashless payment systems.  

 

 

We are bulk vending operators.  Some machines (not to mention them by name ) can accept Dollar Bills but the 99% of machines out there cannot.  You are very fortunate to accept many payment options and even to be able to consider cashless payment systems, but at this point, the millions upon millions of bulk vending machines out there cannot.

 

I agree that you full line vendors have millions of dollars in equipment invested.  But, I can also tell you that many bulk operators on here have millions upon millions upon millions of dollars invested in bulk vending equipment as well.  We have a very large industry with very well invested and well run companies.  Do not discount that.  In my travels and as well as my experience, operators in other countries do much better per machine average with much more profit than us here in the USA.  What do we bulk vendors do in 19 years when we have no choice but to vend at $2?  I can remember like it was yesterday I was 18 years old in 1994 and I waited for my dad to go to Hong Kong to change some of our machines to 50 cents.  When he came back he wanted to kill me.  He said we will never have a 50 cent capsule and here was a guy that went from a penny to a quarter.  19 years comes very fast!!!!

[moondog]

We are bulk vending operators.  Some machines (not to mention them by name ) can accept Dollar Bills but the 99% of machines out there cannot.  You are very fortunate to accept many payment options and even to be able to consider cashless payment systems, but at this point, the millions upon millions of bulk vending machines out there cannot.

 

I agree that you full line vendors have millions of dollars in equipment invested.  But, I can also tell you that many bulk operators on here have millions upon millions upon millions of dollars invested in bulk vending equipment as well.  We have a very large industry with very well invested and well run companies.  Do not discount that.  In my travels and as well as my experience, operators in other countries do much better per machine average with much more profit than us here in the USA.  What do we bulk vendors do in 19 years when we have no choice but to vend at $2?  I can remember like it was yesterday I was 18 years old in 1994 and I waited for my dad to go to Hong Kong to change some of our machines to 50 cents.  When he came back he wanted to kill me.  He said we will never have a 50 cent capsule and here was a guy that went from a penny to a quarter.  19 years comes very fast!!!!

 

Frank.

 

The people don't want the one dollar coin and whether it would help your industry or mine is of no consequence.  The fact that the Feds would consider cramming it down their throats leaves me cold.  Just because the Europeans do it is a poor argument.  This country has spent the majority of my lifetime cleaning up their messes.

[Frank]

It will save 4 Billion Dollars of tax payers money.