PinkJazzX Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Hello there. Just for curiosity, I was looking on how much current glass front vending machines sell for on the used market, and it seems that the D-N BevMax 4 sells for a premium compared to its competitors, and tends to be less readily available. On the other end of the spectrum, the Vendo Vue generally sells for the least amount of money on the used market and tends to be the most readily available. Is there any particular reason why the BevMax 4 sells for a premium compared to its competitors on the used market? I know it is generally the highest-rated current glassfront by most here, although the Royal Vision also gets good reviews as well. Perhaps vending companies and bottlers are quite happy with their BevMax 4s that they are unwilling to let them go. It seems that most of the newest Coke and Pepsi glassfronts I have seen are BevMax 4s. In fact, the local Pepsi bottler in Phoenix has largely gotten rid of most of their Vendo Vues, with very few still in service here. The local Coke bottler experimented with both the Vendo Vue and Royal Vision, but has since standardized on the D-N BevMax 4 for all new glassfronts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZVendor Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 The DN Bev 4 is considered by most to be the Cadillac of glassfront elevator drink machines due to the fact that DN has worked all the bugs out of the Bev 2 and 3's, making the Bev 4 very reliable. The Royal RVV500 is a close second but only if you have a late model version which also has most of the bugs of the early versions corrected. The Bev 4 is about a $6 to $7k machine so the prices stay real high on the used market and because of their cost, and the Royal's cost, you will find very few have even been purchased by regular vending companies. This does then keep the priced of used machines up pretty high. If forgot to add that the Vendo Vue was a clusterf*** when it came out and Vendo really drug their feet correcting the weaknesses, many of which surrounded the delivery port and the "hand" that could be defeated so product could be stolen. Vendo is now releasing a new version of the Vue but it remains to be seen how well designed it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I think you hit the nail on the head with your assumptions. The bevmax 4 is regarded as the best glassfront and people don't seem to want to get rid of them because they are probably considered the real workhorses of robotic glassfronts. The Royal Vision is a good vendor and I believe it is nicer in my opinion. They tend to not only be cheaper on the used market but also cheaper when purchased new. The Vendo Vue has had many issues for a long time now so it's at the very bottom. An AMS bottle vendor (refrigerated snack machine) or a USI Alpine is better than a Vendo Vue. The Royal Visions had issues with wiring getting disconnected (design flaw) when they first came out. In the past few years, I think they have corrected those issues and they are good glassfronts now. I think you would be fine with a Royal Vision or a Bevmax 4 if the price is right... as for prices... I couldn't tell you... there just aren't that many of them out there in the used market so prices can range from as low as $2,000 in rough shape to almost $5,000 for a used bevmax 4. Vendo is now releasing a new version of the Vue but it remains to be seen how well designed it is. It's a shame because I believe the Vendo v21 is the best stack vendor out there right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel Posted December 5, 2014 Share Posted December 5, 2014 My fleet comprises both RVV 500 and Bevmax 4 and I have bought a lot of them this year. I always buy these machines new because in all cases I place them all onto reasonably busy locations and I don't take the risk of buying old secondhand, for premium locations I want them to work and work . I think they are both fantastic machines and I have had little to no problems with them both, personally I prefer the Royal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moondog Posted December 5, 2014 Share Posted December 5, 2014 More and more, around here I see the bottlers reverting back to the Royal G111 804s in place of the elevator machines. It might just be a capacity issue, but I have noticed where they'll fail to repair their glassfronts for weeks on end. I own two glassfronts, the Royal and a Dixie 5591 and both have been pretty good operations wise but I won't be buying any more of them due to their lack of capacity versus a big stacker machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel Posted December 5, 2014 Share Posted December 5, 2014 I strongly beleive a full glassfront like the RVV500 or the Bevmax4 will out perform any other drink machine in terms of sales volume. The DN5591 is now a very old machine where the gates can cause vend problems snd it only has diving boards to break the fall of the drink, i dont think you can compare that machine to the machines with the robotic arms at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 I strongly beleive a full glassfront like the RVV500 or the Bevmax4 will out perform any other drink machine in terms of sales volume. The DN5591 is now a very old machine where the gates can cause vend problems snd it only has diving boards to break the fall of the drink, i dont think you can compare that machine to the machines with the robotic arms at all. I fully agree with you that, regarding sales volume, you cannot compare a newer glassfront with a robotic arm to an older machine. You CAN, however, compare the initial investment.. and now you get down to a numbers battle. I don't know what it's like where you live reel, but around here, you don't make a ton of profits from vending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 Chris, Yes quite true i can buy DN5591 drink machines very cheap as well, i just choose not to at this stage. The 5591 could be ok if you can buy them cheap and convert to a combination machine at a reasonable cost and install new gates. I operate in an extremely competitive market and for large premium locations we secure we provide them with the best machines on the market, often better than what is on offer from Coke Vending. This way all a competitor can offer is cheaper prices and that is not enough to secure prime locations in my opinion. Yes, i agree profit margins in vending are overall very slim, however we are consistently trying to squeeze more profit wherever we can whether thats through buying better, cutting costs and seeking higher volume accounts etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 Chris, Yes quite true i can buy DN5591 drink machines very cheap as well, i just choose not to at this stage. The 5591 could be ok if you can buy them cheap and convert to a combination machine at a reasonable cost and install new gates. I operate in an extremely competitive market and for large premium locations we secure we provide them with the best machines on the market, often better than what is on offer from Coke Vending. This way all a competitor can offer is cheaper prices and that is not enough to secure prime locations in my opinion. Yes, i agree profit margins in vending are overall very slim, however we are consistently trying to squeeze more profit wherever we can whether thats through buying better, cutting costs and seeking higher volume accounts etc. I am sure you have a very good business model and I do believe that you are making some of the best decisions for that model but sometimes I think your opinion doesn't apply to many other small vendors on these forums as they don't deal with such prime locations. I just think it is important for you to mention that your mindset with buying new equipment generally only applies to prime locations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reel Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 I note your comments, however I doubt anyone would be buying new rvv500 or a bevmax 4 glassfront drink machines for anything less than a prime location. What I say is my opinion, frankly I couldn't care whether anyone reads my posts or not. I will leave you to convey your vast experience in micro business to the small vendors as you described them on this forum. Once you have accumulated 30 years of proven success in business, than your comments just may mean something to someone, other than myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 I note your comments, however I doubt anyone would be buying new rvv500 or a bevmax 4 glassfront drink machines for anything less than a prime location. What I say is my opinion, frankly I couldn't care whether anyone reads my posts or not. I will leave you to convey your vast experience in micro business to the small vendors as you described them on this forum. Once you have accumulated 30 years of proven success in business, than your comments just may mean something to someone, other than myself. How about.. when the topic is regarding new machines instead of used machines, then you can use your 30 years of experience to weigh in . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chocolate Bar W / Nuts Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 That's a great idea, A.C.! Maybe there should be a new equipment forum category. Like Reel, I usually purchase new equipment for my accounts for the same reasons as his and more. I've been lurking around in the biz for the past 19 years and can honestly say that of the hundreds of accounts I've serviced through the years, I've been booted out of 2.....maybe 3...and I attribute a lot of my location retainment rate to using new equipment. Using new or like new equipment definitely makes it tougher for another company to unseat you from an account. The competition is kind of forced to at least match or exceed the quality of equipment that's currently there. Just this past week, I was usurped from a location i've had for 13 years by a vending company offering a micro market. I have a Merchant Media snack with all the bells & whistles there, so the competition had to come correct in order to shoe horn me out of there...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew0582 Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 what is all involved in converting a 5591 to a combo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 That's a great idea, A.C.! Maybe there should be a new equipment forum category. Like Reel, I usually purchase new equipment for my accounts for the same reasons as his and more. I've been lurking around in the biz for the past 19 years and can honestly say that of the hundreds of accounts I've serviced through the years, I've been booted out of 2.....maybe 3...and I attribute a lot of my location retainment rate to using new equipment. Using new or like new equipment definitely makes it tougher for another company to unseat you from an account. The competition is kind of forced to at least match or exceed the quality of equipment that's currently there. Just this past week, I was usurped from a location i've had for 13 years by a vending company offering a micro market. I have a Merchant Media snack with all the bells & whistles there, so the competition had to come correct in order to shoe horn me out of there...... I would have mixed feelings about that. Thirteen years is a long time to be in business with someone, but a micro market is the latest thing right now. It's like being married and then being told that you're nice and all but your getting older and the other guy is younger and nicer looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chocolate Bar W / Nuts Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 Ha! Ha! Great analogy! Unfortunately the decision to throw me out with the garbage came from their corporate big wigs. My contact was very reluctant to follow through with the decision and said if the Micro Market does not meet their expectations in any way, they will reinstate my services. I would go back in with a Merchant Media & a new Bevmax 4...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 Ha! Ha! Great analogy! Unfortunately the decision to throw me out with the garbage came from their corporate big wigs. My contact was very reluctant to follow through with the decision and said if the Micro Market does not meet their expectations in any way, they will reinstate my services. I would go back in with a Merchant Media & a new Bevmax 4...... I would like to believe that, if they went back with you, you could see another 13 years from them. It's the old "You don't know what you've got until it's gone" way of thinking. Unfortunately, I think we all know that once a relationship is over, no one wants to bow down and say "I was wrong, I want you back." I hope you do get them back though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chocolate Bar W / Nuts Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 Yep, you're right about that good sir. I think the only real chance I have in eventually recapturing the account is if the employees kick & scream about the huge price increase that they are about to be blessed with...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 Yep, you're right about that good sir. I think the only real chance I have in eventually recapturing the account is if the employees kick & scream about the huge price increase that they are about to be blessed with...... Of course... price increases are one of the "benefits" of switching to micro markets. I don't know if I will ever make that switch though. If I ever decide to leave the vending-machine niche, I will probably move away from vending entirely. I don't want to be a mobile convenience store restocker... aka: micro market operator. It's a cool niche and I think it's here to stay but it doesn't apply everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chocolate Bar W / Nuts Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I'm right there with you on that one. 65% of my accounts are office building common areas, so I don't have to worry about being replaced by micro markets in those locations, and the rest of my location portfolio consist of businesses that are unlikely candidates for one reason or another. As far as the original topic is concerned, Bevmax 4s are almost non-existent in the used equipment market here in the Dallas area and believe you me, I troll CL 3-4 times everyday looking for 4s and Crane Merchant snack machines. In the last 4 years, I've only seen 3 for sale and I snapped them up. I've seen Vendo Vues on CL but I've never purchased any, I just haven't been a big fan of those models. But now Vendo has a new model out that reminds me of the Bevmax. The new model has a carrying cup similar to the Bevmax and a super cool touch interactive purchasing experience! I saw it at the NAMA show in Chicago earlier this year and my immediate reaction was "this is way cooler than the Bevmax!" I'll have my 1st Vendo glass front on the route before the end of the month Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryChris Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 But now Vendo has a new model out that reminds me of the Bevmax. The new model has a carrying cup similar to the Bevmax and a super cool touch interactive purchasing experience! I saw it at the NAMA show in Chicago earlier this year and my immediate reaction was "this is way cooler than the Bevmax!" I'll have my 1st Vendo glass front on the route before the end of the month Please let us know how that works out for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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